Re: Murder in Jocotepec

by Playaboy Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:54 pm

I just find it a little odd that there are 25 pages of posts regarding the La Floresta murders and only 10 pages (less the BS) on the Joco murder.

I guess if you are protecting a dog and get killed there is outrage. If you drink a lot of booze (the pastime of a lot retired people Lakeside) and live in a trailer, you somehow had it coming.

The difference in peoples reactions to the 2 incidents is amazing to me.

by CheenaGringo Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:09 pm

Playaboy:

Could it be about the neighborhood and social status? While the Ajijic murders had plenty of responses over a relatively short period of time, this topic seems to have some legs because of the alleged grizzly details. But of greater importance, the new gates in La Floresta have more than enough involvement on both forums!

by Lady Otter Latté Thu Mar 13, 2014 9:20 pm

Playaboy, where do you get the idea that the La Floresta couple were murdered protecting a dog and that was where the outrage came from? I have heard it was a revenge murder, that it was over a large screen television and that it was an alcohol/drug fueled combination of both. The dog was not even mentioned until a day or two later and that was someone asking if anyone knew what happened to him.

by Playaboy Thu Mar 13, 2014 9:42 pm

Lady Otter Latté wrote:Playaboy, where do you get the idea that the La Floresta couple were murdered protecting a dog and that was where the outrage came from? I have heard it was a revenge murder, that it was over a large screen television and that it was an alcohol/drug fueled combination of both. The dog was not even mentioned until a day or two later and that was someone asking if anyone knew what happened to him.

I reread both threads before I posted. There is a lot of wild speculations in both threads. It was the tone of the posts in different threads that seem a weird to me.

Lady, read them again. One is about a nice couple living in a nice Frac and the other is about a drunk living in a trailer park (trailer trash). I think Cheena hit the nail on the head, he sees what I see.

Cheena the only reason this topic is still current is because of the article in the Guad Reporter. There is a lot of extra BS in the Joco murder thread not about the murder.

Here is a prediction that I believe has a good chance to come true: we will never learn what really happened and nobody will go to prison for either of these murders for any length of time if at all.

by Lady Otter Latté Thu Mar 13, 2014 10:01 pm

I got all that, but what I was wondering about is where the idea came from that the murders in La Floresta were over protecting the dog and the subsequent outrage coming from that? I did not see that anywhere.
I think human beings by their nature care more about people they perceive to be like them. Part of it is the tribal mentality and part of it is threat assessment. The more someone is like me the more likely I am to be in danger of the same fate. It is easier to distance oneself from the drunk living in a trailer who even his neighbors disliked. ("See, I am not like him, so I am not in danger.") Humans do not want to believe life is random and out of control. They like to think there is a reason why things happen. It becomes more difficult to do that when the victims live in your neighborhood and have lives very much like your own.

by hickton Thu Mar 13, 2014 10:17 pm

one guy called mendoza jailed , two others release today according to informador.

by slainte39 Fri Mar 14, 2014 12:17 am

hickton wrote:one guy called mendoza jailed , two others release today according to informador.

This guy Mendoza tried to drag the other two in as accomplices from the gitgo....guess it didn't fly.
They have 3 people in custody over the La Floresta murders for various degrees of involvement but I don't think the second brother has been apprehended....could be wrong.

by espíritu del lago Fri Mar 14, 2014 6:00 am

by Playaboy Fri Mar 14, 2014 8:26 am

Lady Otter Latté wrote:Playaboy, where do you get the idea that the La Floresta couple were murdered protecting a dog and that was where the outrage came from? I have heard it was a revenge murder, that it was over a large screen television and that it was an alcohol/drug fueled combination of both. The dog was not even mentioned until a day or two later and that was someone asking if anyone knew what happened to him.

Lady, I stand corrected about the dog. When I read the few posts speculating about protecting animals it just stuck in my head.

by Jeff Raybourne Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:01 am

Playaboy wrote:
Lady Otter Latté wrote:Playaboy, where do you get the idea that the La Floresta couple were murdered protecting a dog and that was where the outrage came from? I have heard it was a revenge murder, that it was over a large screen television and that it was an alcohol/drug fueled combination of both. The dog was not even mentioned until a day or two later and that was someone asking if anyone knew what happened to him.

Lady, I stand corrected about the dog. When I read the few posts speculating about protecting animals it just stuck in my head.

Yeah, and what else possibly confused you?

by Lady Otter Latté Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:04 am

Thank you for clarifying, Playaboy. There have been enough stories going around to confuse anybody.

by Smartalex Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:05 am

Here's the Informador story:

GUADALAJARA, JALISCO (13/MAR/2014) -. The Attorney General of the State formally charged a man who allegedly participated in the murder of a foreigner on 20 February in Jocotepec. The suspect is identified as Miguel Angel Alonzo Mendoza, 35.

Alonzo Mendoza was arrested and charged with the murder of John Paul Abeel, 63, a citizen of the United States of America. His body was found in the trailer park area of Roca Azul in Jocotepec. Investigating police found evidence that led them to believe a crime had been committed.

The prosecutor said Alonzo Mendoza stated that he attacked Abeel along with Gustavo Aguilar Flores, 32, and Carlos de los Santos Xilozóchitl, 30, who were also arrested. However, the authorities released the last two because there was no evidence that they had participated in the killing.

Alonzo Mendoza, who worked as a gardener in the subdivision, told the Prosecutor that on 17 February he went to the home of Abeel to ask for alcohol, but began arguing over a debt of 500 pesos. A struggle ensued.

Alonzo Mendoza then wounded Abeel in the arm with a knife that was in the kitchen and then escaped from the place. The foreigner died of "profuse hemorrhaging."

On 21 February, the authorities managed to find the alleged killer who was finally charged based on his statements and other evidence. He was transferred to the local prison.

by Dr. Sam Thelin Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:28 am

hockables wrote:
arbon wrote:
oncesubtle wrote:
arbon wrote:
lunateak wrote:Ignoring death is endemic to *my* NOB society.

There I fixed it for you.Eh

Arbon, 'fixing' or changing others quotes is not o.k.

Bob, the quote is still there for all to see...

"Ignoring death is endemic to our NOB society."

In the society that I belong to we do not ignore death, we have obituaries, and compulsory health care.

If you make it another 20 years you can bear witness to 40% of the population running around with Dementia & Alzheimers... where is Dr Morgentaler when you need him...

He died of natural causes completely unrelated to being burned at the stake 40 times...

by addtocart Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:32 am

Smartalex wrote:Here's the Informador story:

GUADALAJARA, JALISCO (13/MAR/2014) -. The Attorney General of the State formally charged a man who allegedly participated in the murder of a foreigner on 20 February in Jocotepec. The suspect is identified as Miguel Angel Alonzo Mendoza, 35.

Alonzo Mendoza was arrested and charged with the murder of John Paul Abeel, 63, a citizen of the United States of America. His body was found in the trailer park area of Roca Azul in Jocotepec. Investigating police found evidence that led them to believe a crime had been committed.

The prosecutor said Alonzo Mendoza stated that he attacked Abeel along with Gustavo Aguilar Flores, 32, and Carlos de los Santos Xilozóchitl, 30, who were also arrested. However, the authorities released the last two because there was no evidence that they had participated in the killing.

Alonzo Mendoza, who worked as a gardener in the subdivision, told the Prosecutor that on 17 February he went to the home of Abeel to ask for alcohol, but began arguing over a debt of 500 pesos. A struggle ensued.

Alonzo Mendoza then wounded Abeel in the arm with a knife that was in the kitchen and then escaped from the place. The foreigner died of "profuse hemorrhaging."

On 21 February, the authorities managed to find the alleged killer who was finally charged based on his statements and other evidence. He was transferred to the local prison.

I hate to keep going on about this, but again "witnesses" and "reporters" can't seem to agree if his arm was still attached to his body. If this obvious point is disputed by some and affirmed by others, it casts doubt on every part of the story.

by Smartalex Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:43 am

The guy is dead. Whether or not the arm was still attached is irrelevant to that fact.

by Lady Otter Latté Fri Mar 14, 2014 10:13 am

Thank you, Alex. Once again, you zero in on the main point. John Paul Abeel is still dead with or without his arm attached.

by arbon Fri Mar 14, 2014 10:43 am

Dr. Sam Thelin wrote:1. The arm was removed by a very clean circular cut. It was not broken off (fact).

2. It was apparently the result of some drunken argument which led to a fight (no one may ever know all the details).

3. The authorities caught who did it in a matter of just a few hours.

4. It is not likely that many people personally know how hard the investigators work on solving crimes here. They work many, and often late hours, and are awoken in the middle of the night to go out and investigate crimes. They do not make a lot of money for what they do. That said, the office of the Ministerio Publico feels it is important that they are better enabled to communicate with the foreign population. The agents of the office (I think there are 7?) are going to be taking formal English classes. The classes will be paid, but they are in Guadalajara. There is still a need for transportation to GDL and other related expenses. If anyone is interested in contributing to this, please contact me.

by arbon Fri Mar 14, 2014 10:51 am

hockables wrote:
If you make it another 20 years you can bear witness to 40% of the population running around with Dementia & Alzheimers... where is Dr Morgentaler when you need him...

Hocs'...Do you remember what the doctor said about the dangers of eating burnt steaks after 40 ?

or was it eating 40 burnt steaks, I don't remember. Eh

by Lady Otter Latté Fri Mar 14, 2014 10:52 am

But, Arbon, is that really what Dr. Sam Thelin wrote or did you "fix" it for him?

by slainte39 Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:13 am

Jeff Raybourne wrote:
Playaboy wrote:
Lady Otter Latté wrote:Playaboy, where do you get the idea that the La Floresta couple were murdered protecting a dog and that was where the outrage came from? I have heard it was a revenge murder, that it was over a large screen television and that it was an alcohol/drug fueled combination of both. The dog was not even mentioned until a day or two later and that was someone asking if anyone knew what happened to him.

Lady, I stand corrected about the dog. When I read the few posts speculating about protecting animals it just stuck in my head.

Yeah, and what else possibly confused you?

The revolution that is spreading all over Mexico...bound to confuse any body. Rolling Eyes

by slainte39 Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:18 am

Smartalex wrote:The guy is dead. Whether or not the arm was still attached is irrelevant to that fact.

saracasm alert..."if only the arm could talk, then we would know what really happened"

by arbon Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:20 am

One of the first reports about the couple in La Floresta was that someone had complained about the construction workers next door mistreating a dog, and subsequently the worker/workers were fired.

by kipissippi Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:22 am

I wonder, if he bled out from a knife wound to the arm..that that might be the cause of the different stories.... like one guy saying partially severed and another hearing severed? Just a thought.

by slainte39 Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:32 am

kipissippi wrote:I wonder, if he bled out from a knife wound to the arm..that that might be the cause of the different stories.... like one guy saying partially severed and another hearing severed? Just a thought.

No explanation will ever be good enough for some people, and they will doubt anything, even if it was seen by their own eyes. Can't trust anyone..... Suspect

by CheenaGringo Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:37 am

Besides how can one complete their article for the NATIONAL ENQUIRER? They won't pay for an article without absolutely accurate details!

by addtocart Sat Mar 15, 2014 10:33 am

Smartalex wrote:The guy is dead. Whether or not the arm was still attached is irrelevant to that fact.

My point was not that the guy is dead. My point was if such an obvious thing as a detached arm can't be agreed on by "reporters", then how can you believe any part of the story?

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