Re: Gringos Arming Themselves

by Jim W Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:10 pm

Right on Neil.....once you kill anyone, justified or not, you will never be the same person....whether it be in self defense or in war....or a auto accident.

by CheenaGringo Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:29 pm

Being a non gun owner and never having had to go to war, I cannot and won't comment on those situations.

However, I got my first drivers license while living in Bombay, India. I was under absolute instructions that should I hit or run over a person - I was to keep driving and give zero thought to stopping! I am thankful that I was never dealt that card as I would in all probability be still dealing with that today!

by Jim W Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:45 pm

Neil, we were told to do same in Mexico? Plus I am not a gun owner...sold m all in 2000.

by David Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:10 pm

Lehrer wrote:
CheenaGringo wrote:Speculation Here: But I would be willing to guess that there may be a fair number of illegal guns in the hands of foreigners at the Lake? Some may have been smuggled in along with household goods, especially back in the days before the vehicle x ray machines? But a greater number are probably "street guns" purchased through "sources" by those unwilling to go through the legal process of buying through the Army?
I have personally handled such illegal handguns ("smuggled in along with household goods"), one of which I would love to own (a .45 Colt revolver). But it's illegal and I don't want to take that chance.

As far as "the legal process of buying through the Army," I have a problem with that statement -- I've read elsewhere that the authorities don't really care where or how the weapon was obtained as long as the legalities are followed (read "proper documentation" or "registration")!

People in the know, such as Rolly and David, can correct me if I'm wrong.

You are correct. However, when buying a new firearm the Army is the only way.

by 57Chevy Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:23 pm

It is never worth escalating a situation for the sake of cash or physical belongings. Let the theives have the stuff. It is only when someone is a threat to your life or the life of a loved one that things get hairy.

I still like my idea of a gun club ON THE LAKE. David mentioned they have some on the way to Guad, but for some reason I like the idea of a local club. Keep it local so everyone around the lake knows it is there and it is a gringo hangout. Perhaps only those who have a long history of skeet shooting, target shooting, or hunting, would use a club. But, a message would be sent.

Owning a gun, being trained in its use, and facing the possibility of harming a person in defense of yourself, is a very personal decision that each person has to face on their own. It is true that you are never the same after taking another persons life, but everyone has different belief systems. Some people feel they have the right to defend their own lives against a psychopath. A man who is about to harm you or kill you has chosen to take the risk of retaliation. He has chosen to risk dangers that include his own death. You didn't chose that for him. If he loses his life as a result, it was his fault, not the fault of the person who was forced to defend him or herself. Well, that is how I see it.

Also, much discussion has been made about killing a Mexican and then suffering repercussions from their family. This seems to be predicated on the assumption that a person would stick around to wait for said repercussions. If it were me, I'd get the hell out of Dodge before that could happen.

Well.....all I know is this...I feel sad. What really got to me was the picture of Churo leading the mexican residents through town on the way to Wednesday's meeting singing "Give peace a chance". That is what any rational person would like to have....peace.

by David Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:31 pm

I like your idea of a local gun club.

by 57Chevy Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:34 pm

juanrey wrote:I can only imagine the repercussions within the Mexican community if an expat were to shoot a Mexican by accident. That would be a setback of epic proportions.
Support the public officials by our efforts and with our money.
If things don't turn around to your personal satisfaction, you know the road out of town.
To think that a bunch of us old farts, arming ourselves will do anything positive is irrational thinking.

I don't know Juanrey, you don't look like an "old fart" to me.....If I imagine your photograph to include a handgun, and you get rid of the smile, you could look pretty formidable. Great sunglasses. Maybe a tougher looking hat would help too. Very Happy

by Jim W Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:35 pm

42 kill the thread.... seemed to work for /David....LMAO

by 57Chevy Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:38 pm

David wrote:
mkay wrote:Mexico has reason to resent Gringos with guns. I received an email yesterday from a resident who has lived here for some years who was stopped and searched thoroughly for the first time since moving here from Texas. The police were looking for a concealed weapon ( he did not have one, and there was certainly no probably cause.)
I am concerned about an eventual backlash from the local police as a result of the foreign community trying to take the running of things into our own hands. I suspect there is a limit as to how far we can be indulged before the implied disdain of their work creates ill feeling.

What are you talking about?
What reason does "Mexico" have to resent gringos with guns?
WHO in the foreign community is trying to take "the running of things into our own hands?"
HUH?

AGREE WITH DAVID 100%

by 57Chevy Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:40 pm

Why do you want to kill the thread?

by 57Chevy Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:54 pm

David wrote:I like your idea of a local gun club.

David - you are knowledgable about guns. You, Lehrer, and Intercasa all seem to know alot. Why not go down to the Legion and talk to the boys there? See if you can get a club going. Intercasa, you like trap and skeet, right? Lehrer, if you don't want to shoot anymore, you could teach people. You are always very well spoken. After lots of practise, you can organize competitions. You can do leagues, with teams competing for top honors. And of course, downing a beer afterward with comrades is always a good thing. Beer

by 57Chevy Mon Dec 12, 2011 1:30 am

by susan Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:44 am

this forum is for retirees. i cant imagine what this has done for the elderly who thought of coming here for their golden years. what happened to tennis & bridge? a "gun" topic? & its a very popular one as well. do not be surprised if the real estate people block the information highway.

by hockables Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:58 am

57Chevy wrote:

Owning a gun and facing the possibility of harming a person in defense of yourself, is a very personal decision that each person has to face on their own. A man who is about to harm you or kill you has chosen to take the risk of retaliation. He has chosen to risk his own death.
much has been made about killing a Mexican

Is there a TAXIDERMIST Lakeside?

by Lehrer Mon Dec 12, 2011 10:48 am

While reading the comments added since I signed off last night, I began to visualize the "Gun Club" and its activities. It has been suggested that the "bad guys" will become aware of this and get the message.

I carried that thought to an alternative scenario: The bad guys recognize folks and their cars; they know who has guns. Possibly, they get it in their heads to follow one of the folks to his/her home and think they can come back later to collect some weaponry.

The whole idea has to be thought out, with care and reason.

Gringos Arming Themselves - Page 3 521823

Gringos Arming Themselves - Page 3 521823

by gringal Mon Dec 12, 2011 10:57 am

Savvy post, Lehrer. However, care and reason are not typical qualities in any population, let alone one that's scared out of their collective shorts by the recent violence.

The man who was just murdered while unloading his groceries would have benefited NADA from owning a gun.

by hockables Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:00 am

The Entire Problem the USA has with Guns... is the Prevelance of Guns... a Bad Guy can kick down nearly half the doors and Steal another one

As they Steal one and Provide it to a 12 Year Old Gangbanger... Joe Citizen just goes out and Buys Another ... probably Thru Insurance...

The run-on joke others have about the US is how some asshole can walk down the street, breaking into cars, and by the 6th or 8th car.... He's Armed

The man murdered while unloading his groceries would have benefitted immensely had that gun not been so readily available to some ignorant asshole....

by Solovino Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:01 am

Lehrer wrote:
I carried that thought to an alternative scenario: The bad guys recognize folks and their cars; they know who has guns. Possibly, they get it in their heads to follow one of the folks to his/her home and think they can come back later to collect some weaponry.

The whole idea has to be thought out, with care and reason.

A very good point. Most burglaries happen when people are not at home. Hand guns are one of the most prized items for burglars. Small and easily hidden. And bring a better price on the street than iPods or other small items they grab while you are off shopping at Superlake.

by CheenaGringo Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:04 am

Years ago, there was a story about two armed clowns who went to rob a bar in Detroit about an hour before closing time. 13 patrons pulled out guns and eliminated the problem.

by hockables Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:07 am

CheenaGringo wrote:Years ago, there was a story about two armed clowns who went to rob a bar in Detroit about an hour before closing time. 13 patrons pulled out guns and eliminated the problem.

now, I'm wondering how many of those 13, had permits and actually bought those firearms...

by CheenaGringo Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:21 am

Here is a clue, this incident happened in the late 60's and the bar was a popular late night hangout for some members on the Detroit Lions football team.

No background checks required back then. Permits - Hell No! But I will bet that the Detroit police thanked them for doing their job.

by 57Chevy Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:44 am

Talking about guns, crime, violence, murder, robberies, home invasions - none of these are a favorite topic for anyone. The crime causes anxiety, and then the talk about how to protect yourself causes anxiety.

Guns were on the list by Raqueteer in the thread, "50 ways to beat the bad guys". It is worth it to discuss all of the aspects of this topic, so people can sort through it. Lehrer and Solovino make a good point about guns being ripped off. In response to Lehrer, when you leave the gun club, you are cautious. Be sure no one is following, and you drive a circuitous route home. I do that when I go to Bancomer in Ajijic to get cash. Always being cautious and aware when in the street is a habit I had to learn. That is one of the down sides of living in Mexico.

Maybe it is better to ditch the idea of gun club at the lake, and use the one's that David mentioned, on the way into Guad.

The most important of all the suggestions made by Raqueteer were the ones regarding home security measures.

The man who was murdered - well, I heard two different versions - one is that he was in an open cochera, and one that he was in the street unloading groceries. So, you unload groceries inside a locked cochera. You drive into your cochera and do not get out of the car until you are sure no one followed your car into the cochera. That means you have an automatic door on the cochera. For people without a cochera, who must park in the street ---What about a grocery delivery service? Or, take a taxi and have the taxi driver unload for you for a generous tip.

by 57Chevy Mon Dec 12, 2011 12:05 pm

it's not worth it. talking to junior high school boys is a waste of time.

by hockables Mon Dec 12, 2011 12:05 pm

yankees... lol... Dead Horse

by viajero Mon Dec 12, 2011 12:22 pm

hockables wrote:yankees... lol...

colonials...lol...

by hound dog Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:26 pm

viajero wrote:
hockables wrote:yankees... lol...
colonials...lol...

Miserable, incompetent, sheltered, jingo NOBBERS living amongst innocents posing yourselves as friends who, nevertheless are aware of your tendencies, over time, to lay waste and exploit the cultures and lands you conquer and to belittle their intellectul achievements which, in fact, exceed your own but with less effective battlements with which to defend themselves. Take pride in that carnage amigos.

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