Bad News - Written bad news Aduana Residente Permanente

I did consider that.

The car is old but sturdy and very safe, 4x4 fun in the mountains, not worth much, and may not make it to the border. . . What do you mean by "dumping" it? Selling it? Those used car guys along the border know EXACTLY what is happening down here and are offering squat for the cars because they know they have you over a barrel. Did you mean actually just parking it and dumping it? Reporting it stolen in the US?

My immigration lawyers are nationalizing cars and said they would do mine for just under 2000US, if I remember right, and I wouldn't have to go anywhere. Spencer might do it too, dunno.

brigitte wrote:Good point Cheenagringo and Trailrunner should read what Intercasa has to say about nationalization on Chapala.com.
Naturalization could also be closed up. Check with his thread or talk to someone who can give you sound advice about it. Do not think it is a right you have, it is not that clear cut.It is also not that cheap even if you are lucky enough to get a person who does it correctly and does not give you funny papers. Be careful. Check with your insurrance agent and discuss it with him or her just to hear what he /she has to say about it.

Arrgghh. I'll go read it. Thanks.

Read the tob Spencer is not nationalizing cars and advising against nationalizing any cars because of what he heard or read from the aduana in Mexico CIty.
There is a lot of fraud going on, you get your papers and they are phonies so you lose your car and you go to jail. You may want to look into that one and not trust anybody who tells you "no problemas"

I did not mention dumping anything but be careful.

Well, sounds like there's gonna be a lot of us taking the bus.

Trailrunner:

Sorry for my choice of words. By dumping I meant selling hopefully at a decent price maybe using Craigslist or Auto Trader to a private party. Selling to a used car dealer is often a losing proposition. If you were to take whatever you get and add the $2000 it might cost you to nationalize, I would think you would be on your way towards a used Mexican plated vehicle. You state that it may not be able to make it to the border, so I have to wonder about putting $2K in fees and paperwork into a vehicle that has seen its better days?

Note: You have really hurt my feelings by suggesting that I was recommending parking and reporting the car stolen! HA!

:)

thank you, Spencer for your Authoritative information.
For months I have been telling friends who ask this question the same thing you have advised: Until Aduana posts rules IN WRITING, it is just opinion and rumor. Now that we have it in writing, we know what our options are.

I have pretty much assumed that "permanente" would be treated like the old "immigrado" = no foreign plated cars.
Big time thanks to you for staying on top of this matter. Some may bitch and moan, but it is what it is, eh?

brigitte wrote:Good point Cheenagringo and Trailrunner should read what Intercasa has to say about nationalization on Chapala.com.
Naturalization could also be closed up. Check with his thread or talk to someone who can give you sound advice about it. Do not think it is a right you have, it is not that clear cut.It is also not that cheap even if you are lucky enough to get a person who does it correctly and does not give you funny papers. Be careful. Check with your insurrance agent and discuss it with him or her just to hear what he /she has to say about it.

Ok, I've read C.com. Looks like I'm pretty SOL. I forgot that I cannot nationalize my car it was manufactured in Japan, non NAFTA country. I don't want to, and I don't think it would be practical, to drive it to the border and try to sell it to a private party. And the used car guys won't give me squat for it. I won't donate it to the MX government or another foreigner who will legalize it. That leaves junking it or parting it out. I favor the latter and will have a conversation with my local shade tree mechanic and a couple of others to see if that's an option. I suppose the junk yards won't pay much for it either. This is a bit of a bonanza for some of the folks on the receiving end of these old cars.

Think I'll have to cut my losses and buy a small used Mexican car.

Thanks, Brigitte, for your interpretations and direction to Spencer's conversations on C.com

SPENCER! You da man. Thanks for all you do and all the best with the root canal tomorrow! :)

If you are going to go up North why not drive it up there and try to sell it or donate it to a good cause up there , you can always take the bus back. You may be getting people to go with you and split the cost of the trip and not drive alone.
Do not forget that you can be found out via the VIN number if anything happens to someone because of the car if it stays here and you are liable. Sorry to bring you another bit of bad news but we went through the same thing before we drove our cars bak up north.
There are plenty of poor people in Southern AZ just give it to the first guy you see on the road driving a bicycle...Go to a catholic church where all the illegal workers gather and turn it over to the priest or to the guys hanging outside, someone will want it I promise.

It may not make it to the border, it need work that I've put off waiting to see how this all went. If it breaks down along the way, I'm stuck with a broken car, motels, waiting for parts, and I may be doing it by myself. I'm just not up for all that $hit.

If I give it to some day laborer in AZ, I get nada for it. At least if I have the mechanic here part it out I get something for it and can get the windshield sticker, parts where the VIN number is located, and maybe junk the rest.

That's my working diagnosis for the moment, it too will evolve. Thanks everyone for all the good input, much appreciated.

seisdedos wrote:Gee, there must be SOME way for these people to keep their cars here. Con el dinero baila el perro or so say some. A good lawyer that knows the system should be able to handle it.

There is a way. It is the same way large semi-new semi rigs from the USA are on the road in Mexico with a Mexican title and plates without paying the import tax. However, it is not legal. The Mexican law should read that it is only illegal if caught

MexicoPete wrote:I asked the Red Cross (actually Charlie of the Red Cross) if I could donate my vehicle to them. This was maybe two months ago. He said that it would not make sense for them to accept it, something about the Red Tape, etc. I don't remember.

Oh well. At least I'm in the process of purchasing a Mexican plated car.

All you need to do is transfer the ownership on the back of the title to the Cruz Roja Mexicana IAP, and we write a receipt for the value. All the rest of the process is handled by the CRM, and you are done the moment you sign the title and get the receipt.

Trailrunner wrote:If I give it to some day laborer in AZ, I get nada for it. At least if I have the mechanic here part it out I get something for it and can get the windshield sticker, parts where the VIN number is located, and maybe junk the rest.

It's my understanding that turning in your import sticker at the frontier only absolves you from liability if that sticker is attached to a car. In fact, a Mexican official comes out and actually scrapes the sticker off your windshield. Unless the law has changed, the Mexicans don't allow you to junk a car here for parts and then hand in your import sticker.

Trailrunner got here a year or two before I did and my TIP dates to 2006. I wonder if we are even in the computer.

As long as the car and VIN never hits the road again there should be no risk, we have no deposit to protect and we'll need a Mexican car anyway

I arrived here in 2002. In 2012 I drove my U.S.-plated car to the border and turned in the sticker. My TIP/vehicle was in the computer.
As I said, unless the law has changed, as long as Trailrunner hasn't legally removed his vehicle from Mexico, he'll be in violation of the law, whether he drives his truck or not.

None of the options are very good for me and my car, I have to pick the least of the difficult options.

There must be lots of people whose cars are not worth driving to the border and trying to sell, or people who are too elderly or sick to do it, or cannot afford to do it. What will those folks do?

Hope a new and better option pops up in the next month.

You can check to see if your TIP is in the computer by entering your name and passport number on the online TIP system to see if it blocks you by saying you already have a car here. I have seen TIPS from 2004 still showing.

Got a new passport 2/3 years ago

My car was seriously flooded here during Jova so only 90% or the electrical works, with a few dents, weak suspension, scratched windshield, etc .... park it in the back 40 and tell a few local junk yards I have parts

The letter of the law does not bother me in this case

Spencer, what is the link I want to check. I get a new passport next year.

I'm with you, Sparks, if I'm not in the computer.

Searched this site: http://www.aduanas.gob.mx/aduana_mexico/2008/pasajeros/139_10242.html

Both Aduana and Banjercito sites for name, passport, name and passport, and SAT Folio number. No hay resultados

My TIP dated from 20002. At the Laredo border crossing it took the Mexican customs officer about five full minutes to locate it in his computer, but find it he did. IMHO, if my TIP was in the computer, so is everyone else's who entered Mexico after me. I have a suspicion that this notion of Mexicans "losing" TIPs in the transition to computerization is an urban myth.

Use the Banjercito site and check under old passport number with name when you got original TIP.

Electronic pre-authorization .... is where I stopped. Exchanging too much info

PM sent

To sum it up very succinctly, this from ssauto on TOB:

"You have three choices (if you maintain a permanent VISA status): 1) pay the duty to permanently import the vehicle; 2) take the vehicle back to U.S. or Canada and sell it there; or 3) Continue driving the vehicle in Mexico and risk losing it to the authorities.