No simple answers

by Lady Otter Latté Sun Dec 16, 2012 12:50 pm

http://crooksandliars.com/susie-madrak/i-am-adam-lanzas-mother-lets-talk-abo

by Flamingo Sun Dec 16, 2012 1:29 pm

This is so heart breaking. Anyone who has known families with mentally ill children knows some of what these parents go through. Mental health professional predicted this when we started to cut funding on in-patient mental health facilities and send patients back into the community.

What do other countries do? It can't be as bad as what we are doing in the U.S.

by ferret Sun Dec 16, 2012 1:55 pm

It is heartbreaking but ask yourself this...when a family has a mentally ill person in the house, why would they also have guns in the house. It's a recipe for disaster.
Somewhere in my bookmarks, I've got a link for "chemicals in food that cause aggressive behaviour". I'll look for it later.

by Lady Otter Latté Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:00 pm

Ferret, I think we all have been asking ourselves that as this tragic story unfolds. It appears as though Adam was not the only one in his home with mental health issues. However, this article is not about what was going on in that one particular household. It is asking us to look at the human tragedy of mental illness and the state of our mental health and prison systems.

by CheenaGringo Sun Dec 16, 2012 2:41 pm

Reflecting back without doing any Internet research, it seems to me that there have been a number of these overly bright home schooled youths that have snapped and committed atrocious acts against family, friends, co-workers and simply total strangers. It seems to me that when parents make a decision to essentially remove their children from society, it reduces the opportunities for outside objective observation where mental health issues might be recognized. Furthermore by making the decision to minimize their child's societal contact, it becomes the parent's full responsibility to recognize mental health issues and provide treatment.

by joec Sun Dec 16, 2012 4:56 pm

CheenaGringo wrote:Reflecting back without doing any Internet research, it seems to me that there have been a number of these overly bright home schooled youths that have snapped and committed atrocious acts against family, friends, co-workers and simply total strangers. It seems to me that when parents make a decision to essentially remove their children from society, it reduces the opportunities for outside objective observation where mental health issues might be recognized. Furthermore by making the decision to minimize their child's societal contact, it becomes the parent's full responsibility to recognize mental health issues and provide treatment.

I fully agree and it's time parents took the blame for some of this. They should be recognizing social traits in their kids that could lead to disaster and get them some help.

Does anyone know if the new Obamacare plan could provide mental health benefits to these families?

It is also time for school systems around the country to have a plainclothes armed guard on premises mandated by Federal law. Let the school systems cough up some more money. If not that, then metal detectors.

by hound dog Sun Dec 16, 2012 5:17 pm

How sublime are thought processes emanating from third parties not burdened by direct or indirect responsibilty for the possible ramifications of the complexities of mental illness among close or extended family members of other families not members of extended clans. How easily we judge others from a distance of, perhaps, thousands of kilometers in physical distance and a million kilometers mentally from the sick f*ck who was someone´s progeny. Our flesh and blood may be antisocially murderous unbeknownst to us until the massacre or other anti- social act has taken place. Get off the high horse pea brains. This is terrible tragedy not to be gratuiously analyzed by amateurs.

by RoofBob Sun Dec 16, 2012 5:30 pm

[quote="joec"] Does anyone know if the new Obamacare plan could provide mental health benefits to these families?quote]
I believe it does but Boner and the repubs. want to cut those entitlements as part of the new budget.

by hound dog Sun Dec 16, 2012 5:35 pm

joec wrote:
CheenaGringo wrote:Reflecting back without doing any Internet research, it seems to me that there have been a number of these overly bright home schooled youths that have snapped and committed atrocious acts against family, friends, co-workers and simply total strangers. It seems to me that when parents make a decision to essentially remove their children from society, it reduces the opportunities for outside objective observation where mental health issues might be recognized. Furthermore by making the decision to minimize their child's societal contact, it becomes the parent's full responsibility to recognize mental health issues and provide treatment.

I fully agree and it's time parents took the blame for some of this. They should be recognizing social traits in their kids that could lead to disaster and get them some help.

Does anyone know if the new Obamacare plan could provide mental health benefits to these families?

It is also time for school systems around the country to have a plainclothes armed guard on premises mandated by Federal law. Let the school systems cough up some more money. If not that, then metal detectors.

The school in Connecticut was under full lockdown and no one was allowed to enter without permission. This maniac broke the thick protective glass barring entry with the butt of his mama´s assault rifle, shot those guarding the premise and then proceeded to massacre 20 six and seven year old kindergartners by shooting each victim numerous times with that same assault rifle to make sure they were dead.

It disgusts me that you made a repulsive political reference to "Obama Care" in your nasty screed. You have exhibited no common decency.

By the way; that murderous sumbitch would have mowed down any armed guard on duty in the blink of a eye.

Please move to North Carolina at your first opportunity. You clearly belong in that hillbilly sh*thole.

by joec Sun Dec 16, 2012 5:48 pm

[quote="RoofBob"]

joec wrote: Does anyone know if the new Obamacare plan could provide mental health benefits to these families?quote]
I believe it does but Boner and the repubs. want to cut those entitlements as part of the new budget.

I don't know if taking care of your citizens should be called entitlements. If that is true, then they are morons. Maybe they need to look at cutting Defense spending and govermental waste.

by CheenaGringo Sun Dec 16, 2012 5:54 pm

Dawg:

Thank you for pointing out the errors in my poorly worded post. My original intent was to speculate whether or not home schooling genius level kids provides social skills and adaptation but I slid into pontificating or injecting my opinion. I just read where he took some college courses starting at age 16, so I guess he wasn't all home schooled as previously reported.

by joec Sun Dec 16, 2012 5:55 pm

hound dog wrote:
joec wrote:
CheenaGringo wrote:Reflecting back without doing any Internet research, it seems to me that there have been a number of these overly bright home schooled youths that have snapped and committed atrocious acts against family, friends, co-workers and simply total strangers. It seems to me that when parents make a decision to essentially remove their children from society, it reduces the opportunities for outside objective observation where mental health issues might be recognized. Furthermore by making the decision to minimize their child's societal contact, it becomes the parent's full responsibility to recognize mental health issues and provide treatment.

I fully agree and it's time parents took the blame for some of this. They should be recognizing social traits in their kids that could lead to disaster and get them some help.

Does anyone know if the new Obamacare plan could provide mental health benefits to these families?

It is also time for school systems around the country to have a plainclothes armed guard on premises mandated by Federal law. Let the school systems cough up some more money. If not that, then metal detectors.

The school in Connecticut was under full lockdown and no one was allowed to enter without permission. This maniac broke the thick protective glass barring entry with the butt of his mama´s assault rifle, shot those guarding the premise and then proceeded to massacre 20 six and seven year old kindergartners by shooting each victim numerous times with that same assault rifle

I did not m to make sure they were dead.

It disgusts me that you made a repulsive political reference to "Obama Care" in your nasty screed. You have exhibited no common decency.

By the way; that murderous sumbitch would have mowed down any armed guard on duty in the blink of a eye.

Please move to North Carolina at your first opportunity. You clearly belong in that hillbilly sh*thole.

I didn't make any derogatory comments that you should have ATTACKED me that way. I only asked about Obama care since NONE of the people who voted for it know NOTHING about it including yourself. YOU ARE A NASTY OLD MAN WITH MAJOR MENTAL HEALTH PROBLEMS. Get some help and go back on your meds. Go back to Chiapas. We don't want you here. North Carolina is far from hillbilly craphole, you must be confusing it with Lowclassabama.

Are you trying to drive this topic into OCTAGON???

by gringal Sun Dec 16, 2012 6:39 pm

As I interpreted Roofbob's post, he was suggesting that the families should be entitled to Govt. mental health care after that trauma.

by sundown Sun Dec 16, 2012 6:40 pm

Is there a topic on this website that does not end up in name calling by the same people? I agree that Politics should not have been brought into this discussion, and people should not be insulted because of the state they come from.

by RoofBob Sun Dec 16, 2012 6:53 pm

Si gringal, mucho correcto.

by jrm30655 Sun Dec 16, 2012 6:56 pm

The Israelis had the same problem with terrorists attacking schools. They trained and armed the teachers and the problem went away.

You never hear of one of these people attacking a police station. Those guys have guns and shoot back.

Everyone of these shootings has taken place in a location where guns are not allowed.

The US has 307MM people and some are crazy enough to do this. You cannot prevent them all from starting but you can stop them quicker if their victims are armed.

by seisdedos Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:00 pm

So what happens when an armed teacher goes berserk and shoots a bunch of students? All of this bullshit about everyone carrying a weapon is insane. Yeah, that's the solution, more focking guns.

by David Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:04 pm

[quote="joec YOU ARE A NASTY OLD MAN WITH MAJOR MENTAL HEALTH PROBLEMS. Get some help and go back on your meds.
Are you trying to drive this topic into OCTAGON???[/quote]

John, you described yourself perfectly! Again!

by jrm30655 Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:09 pm

seisdedos wrote:So what happens when an armed teacher goes berserk and shoots a bunch of students? All of this bullshit about everyone carrying a weapon is insane. Yeah, that's the solution, more focking guns.

One of the other teachers blows him away?

Do you not think that a teacher can bring in a gun if he wants to?

by CheenaGringo Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:11 pm

That may be the most assine suggestion I have ever read or at the very least a perfect example of not facing up to the overriding problem - there are too many uncontrolled guns coupled with too many unstable people! You have a problem with guns, so the answer is to put more guns out there?

Answer a question please - when did all of thsi BS start? And who, what, when or where do you place the blame?

by jrm30655 Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:15 pm

The second amendment was not put in for hunters, it was put in so the people could protect themselves from the government if necessary. It was so important that it was second, just after freedom of speech.

Go read Jeffersons and Hamiltons papers to see just what they were thinking.

Considering that the government has no knock warrents, taps the internet for all your e-mails, web history etc. Has cameras everywhere with facial recognition and taps your phone info to see where you have been and who you talked to, sounds to me like the founding fathers were pretty smart.

by jrm30655 Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:24 pm

CheenaGringo wrote:That may be the most assine suggestion I have ever read or at the very least a perfect example of not facing up to the overriding problem - there are too many uncontrolled guns coupled with too many unstable people! You have a problem with guns, so the answer is to put more guns out there?

Answer a question please - when did all of thsi BS start? And who, what, when or where do you place the blame?

You might want to read this before you continue this conversation: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-12-15/newtown-shooter-had-asperger-syndrome-and-some-us-gun-facts

If you want crime to go up, look at Australia. They banned guns and the crime went stright up.

The blame? The shooter... Who else?

by CheenaGringo Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:26 pm

You are certainly free to throw around the 2nd Ammendment but I am perfectly willing to go from #1 to #3 to stop this BS!

by ferret Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:28 pm

hound dog wrote:How sublime are thought processes emanating from third parties not burdened by direct or indirect responsibilty for the possible ramifications of the complexities of mental illness among close or extended family members of other families not members of extended clans. How easily we judge others from a distance of, perhaps, thousands of kilometers in physical distance and a million kilometers mentally from the sick f*ck who was someone´s progeny. Our flesh and blood may be antisocially murderous unbeknownst to us until the massacre or other anti- social act has taken place. Get off the high horse pea brains. This is terrible tragedy not to be gratuiously analyzed by amateurs.

This pea brained amateur is just looking for possible answers. Although I abhor the gun culture that exists in the U.S., it has always been that way. So, what else changed and why? Yes, the video culture nutures violence.
Here is a link to food additives and their effect on children's behaviour...
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/02/27/food-dyes-suspected-of-causing-behavioral-problems-in-kids/

There are many others if you google "food additives and child behavior". Just food for thought.

by seisdedos Sun Dec 16, 2012 7:53 pm

jrm30655 wrote:
seisdedos wrote:So what happens when an armed teacher goes berserk and shoots a bunch of students? All of this bullshit about everyone carrying a weapon is insane. Yeah, that's the solution, more focking guns.

One of the other teachers blows him away?

Do you not think that a teacher can bring in a gun if he wants to?

Sure they can. But you know that isn't what I was talking about. And as far as another teacher "blowing him away" wouldn't that be after he has a half a dozen dead kids?

Have you ever faced someone with a gun that wants to kill you?

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