Re: Zócalo or Plaza?

by hound dog Sun Jul 15, 2012 11:19 am

Deleted by poster.

by Ricardo Sun Jul 15, 2012 11:22 am

mattoleriver wrote:OOPS! I got a strange link, maybe this will be better.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zocalo

George

"Plinth" is simply the English word for "zócalo" and you posted the English Wikipedia page. "Zócalo" is a word in the standard Spanish vocabulary that came to be applied to what is officially called the Plaza de la Constitución in Mexico City because of a prominent plinth that stood in it at one time without the statue it was intended for. So you might say that that plaza is the only real Zócalo in Mexico as all the other plazas took their name from it.

by brigitte Sun Jul 15, 2012 11:37 am

If they had meant that they would have called it the Plinto, they called it the base or pedestal not the plinth.

by brigitte Sun Jul 15, 2012 12:01 pm

In Tuxtla Gutierrez the plaza is called el parque...
Neil look in the informador where the demonstrations were scheduled on July 13, a lot of them where on the main plazas and you will see what each town calls their main plaza. It goes from plaza to jardin, parque to Zocalo depending on the city.

by CheenaGringo Sun Jul 15, 2012 12:04 pm

Thank you everyone for attempting to clarify my confusion! I will just go with the flow with the understanding that it is one of those local option type things.

by sparks Sun Jul 15, 2012 12:40 pm

I think people would know what you mean ... but calling a small town plaza a zocolo would sound pretty strange. Bigger the town/city the better your chances of it fitting

by bobnliz Sun Jul 15, 2012 5:49 pm

CheenaGringo wrote:So if these two words are somewhat interchangeable, is it offensive to locals to call what is normally referred to as the plaza a zócalo or vice versa?

Not in my experience... though it seems to vary with the community as to whether they use Plaza, Zócalo, or Jardín.
I tend to use Zócalo until I know what the locals are using, and have never been misunderstood on that account. Lizzy

by hound dog Sun Jul 15, 2012 5:59 pm

Different part of the country say different things, try to ask for the tianguis in Chiapas or in some parts of Quintana Roo.. They look at you like if you came from the moon.

by CheenaGringo Mon Jul 16, 2012 8:39 am

On TOB, I ran across a list of the locations in various Mexican cities where protests over the election were being held. Granted many of these locations were stadiums, public buildings, etc but the list also has many zócalos, plazas, jardins, etc:

-Torreon: Plaza de Armas 4pm
-Cd de Mexico: Angel de Independencia 3pm
-Los Angeles CA: Enfrente del Consulado de Mexico en Los Angeles 1pm
-Queretaro: Jardin Guerrero 3pm
-Monterrey: Colegio Civil 3pm
-Los Cabos, San Jose del Cabo: Plaza Mijares 5 pm
-Guadalajara: Plaza Liberacion 3pm
-Puebla: Zocalo 3pm
-Tlaxcala: Plaza de la Constitucion 3pm
-Morelia, Michoacan: Calzada San Diego 3 pm
-Edo de Mex: Alameda Central de Toluca 3pm
-Veracruz: Asta Bandera 5pm
-Xalapa, Veracruz: Teatro del Estado 3pm
-Orizaba, Veracruz: Asilo de Mier y Pesado 3 pm
-Cordoba, Veracruz: 3pm
-Tabasco: Plaza de Armas y Plaza Revolucion 3pm
-Tampico: Plaza de Armas 3pm
-Guaymas, Sonora: Plaza de los tres presidentes 6pm
-Colima: Jardin Libertad 5pm
-Manzanillo: Malecon del Espiritu Santo 3 pm
-Cuernavaca, Morelos: De la Paloma de la Paz al Zocalo 3pm
-Tepoztlan, Morelos: Zocalo 3pm
-Cancun: Parque de las Palapas 3pm
-Ciudad del Carmen, Campeche: Glorieta del Camaron 3pm
-Tuxtla Gutierrez, Chiapas: Parque Central 3pm
-Tlapa de Comonfort, Guerrero: del Hospital General al Zócalo Central de la Ciudad 6pm
-Reynosa, Tamaulipas: Plaza Pricipal 7pm
-Tepic, Nayarit: Plaza Principal 3pm
-Acapulco: en la Diana Calzadora 3pm
-Chetumal, Quintana Roo: Estacionamiento del Bio-Universo 3:30pm
-Acuña, Coahuila: Afuera de SORIANA 5pm
-Ensenada, Baja California: Monumento a Lazaro Cardenas hasta el Parque Revolucion 5pm
-Phoenix, Arizona: Enfrente del Consulado Mexicano 3pm
-Palenque, Chiapas: Cabeza Maya 4pm 15 de JULIO
-Oaxaca:Plaza de las Regiones 3pm
-Tuxpan, Veracruz: Monumento a los niños heroes 4:30pm
-Hermosillo, Sonora:en ley kino, a la plaza zaragoza, 5:00 pm

by CanuckBob Mon Jul 16, 2012 8:52 am

I wonder if there is a bunch of South Asian expats in Vancouver right now having a 3 page discussion on their forum about whether to call it a Shopping Center or a Mall.......jajajaja.

by RoofBob Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:15 am

Hahahaha, maybe they have a message board called Inside Vancouver with an Octagon. I can see it now, a bunch of old nut cases insulting each other in a never ending quest to be the most culturally sensitive and politically savvy. Do you think they swarm? Maybe we could do a 'sister city' board thing, you know, do an international bitch about the cops and pot holes and stuff. ...naw

by bobnliz Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:31 am

ROTFLMAO.... cheers

Lizzy

by CanuckBob Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:38 am

RoofBob wrote: Hahahaha, maybe they have a message board called Inside Vancouver with an Octagon. I can see it now, a bunch of old nut cases insulting each other in a never ending quest to be the most culturally sensitive and politically savvy. Do you think they swarm? Maybe we could do a 'sister city' board thing, you know, do an international bitch about the cops and pot holes and stuff. ...naw

No friggin way.........I just used Mr. Google and they do have one in Vancouver. Too funny. Maybe I'll join up and ask whether to call it a Shopping center or Mall. There is even a few Mexican expats on that forum.

http://www.expat-blog.com/forum/viewforum.php?id=441

by Rosa Venus Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:51 am

That's hysterical. Instead of bitching about topes, they probably complain about the the equally inevitable rain.

by CanuckBob Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:01 am

Well I read a few threads and I can see now why Seisdedos and some of our other Mexican members get so frustrated with us. Some of the total BS they are telling each other is nuts. As an example, one is telling another that you can live in Vancouver for about $1900.00 month. Of course they forgot to mention that you would have to live in a trailer 90 minutes outside of the city for that amount......

by papirex Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:44 am

MexicoPete wrote:
Rosa Venus wrote:A friend of mine from Guadalajara says there is really only one Zócalo in the entire country: Mexico City.

Your friend could well be right. I like plaza better than Zócalo, anyway. I just went to the dictionary and looked up Zócalo and it said that the word means baseboard. I tried an on line service and it showed

Traducción = Socket
Diccionario=
masculine socle, base of a pedestal;
Mexican = public square, center square.

IPete, I think we must be using the same translating dictionaries, the definition for Zocalo is identical in my favorite. I have 6 of them, all paperbacks. I keep 3 of them downstairs, to be handy when I am using my laptop, and 3 of them upstairs near my desktop.

My favorite is The Langenscheidt's pocket dictionary, it was copyrighted in 1985, most of them were gifts from my late Mexicana wife or one of her brothers. They were from México City, I think that is where the story about only one Zocalo in México started. I use both terms interchangeably myself, except when referring to the largest plaza in México City.

I also carry a shirt pocket sized Langenscheidt's in my laptop case to use when traveling. Small, but better than nothing. I no longer have a bi-lingual wife to help me out. I can usually make myself understood, but my Spanish grammar is the pits.

Rex sure don't know which is correct. But everyone seems to understand me when I use either

by hound dog Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:29 am

sparks wrote:I think people would know what you mean ... but calling a small town plaza a zocolo would sound pretty strange. Bigger the town/city the better your chances of it fitting

My little home town of about 7,000 people in the southern United States, 50% of whom were of European extraction and 50% of whom were of African extraction (plus one Greek and one Chinese family and, as in every town on earth, at least a few Labanese), has a main plaza known as Confederate Park and, until the 1970s, the 50% of the locals who were of African descent would have been arrested if, while transitting the plaza, they had taken a moment to sit down on a bench in that plaza to rest their weary bones for even a moment or, God forbid, tried to use a restroom or bought a hamburger thereabouts. Now, in 2012, citizens of any race/heritage are welcome to sit down and rest those bones but it is still known as Confederate Park. I recommend they change the name to the "Zócalo" or, perhaps, the "By God Primary Square".

by bobnliz Mon Jul 16, 2012 1:31 pm

God has nothing to do with it. Zócalo or Plaza? - Page 2 169387

Lizzy

by hound dog Mon Jul 16, 2012 2:55 pm

bobnliz wrote:God has nothing to do with it. Lizzy

Now, now, Liz; God (whatever that is) has everything to do with everything. Perhaps my punctuation was misleading. Let me try again:

The "By God, primary square."

"By God, My God, Good God and in the U.S. Deep South, Good Gawdalmighty" are phrases meant to bestow emphasis and have nothing to do with any supposed deity as you very well know. See if Dawg tries to make humor in your presence again. Well, maybe.

by bobnliz Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:49 pm

Why, Dawg.. .I feel so much better knowing that you still have your tongue tucked in your cheek. Zócalo or Plaza? - Page 2 169387

Lizzy

by viajero Tue Jul 17, 2012 9:12 am

CanuckBob wrote:Well I read a few threads and I can see now why Seisdedos and some of our other Mexican members get so frustrated with us. Some of the total BS they are telling each other is nuts. As an example, one is telling another that you can live in Vancouver for about $1900.00 month. Of course they forgot to mention that you would have to live in a trailer 90 minutes outside of the city for that amount......

They don't have an Octagon??

by CanuckBob Tue Jul 17, 2012 9:20 am

I didn't spend enough time on there to figure that out.

by CheenaGringo Tue Jul 17, 2012 9:28 am

Didn't spend much time looking at it but was struck by the amount of conversation regarding moving Singapore to Vancouver. Have to wonder what's up with that?

by CanuckBob Tue Jul 17, 2012 9:38 am

That is called "the reason Vancouver Real Estate was one of the hottest, most expensive, markets in the world up until about a couple of months ago". Things are finally starting to slow down there I hear.

by LaChula Tue Jul 17, 2012 5:54 pm

Rosa Venus wrote:A friend of mine from Guadalajara says there is really only one Zócalo in the entire country: Mexico City.

[b]My understanding is that Zocalo is used when it is the plaza for a Cathedral, not just any-ol' church.

by eyePad Tue Jul 17, 2012 6:27 pm

Sorry, I can't resist. I'm a student of Spanish and since this is a Spanish word I looked it up in a couple of dictionaries, including the most widely accepted one:

5. m. Méx. Plaza principal de una ciudad.

It doesn't say Ciudad de México, it says any city. Please note it is a mexican word. It also means other things, definitions 1-4, which I won't list. Pretty entertaining reading this thread.

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