Double murder robbery in La Floresta?

I know Nina was passionate about animals and absolutely fierce when she felt they were being abused or mistreated. That was one of the things about her that I greatly admired. That part of the story at least rings true.

Flamingo wrote:I know Nina was passionate about animals and absolutely fierce when she felt they were being abused or mistreated. That was one of the things about her that I greatly admired. That part of the story at least rings true.

Flamingo, We have a ringside seat here and by the looks of things they are turning over all the rocks to find these guys.

[quote="Mainecoons"]

Ms.Thang wrote:A whole thread about the murders just disappeared from c.com. But I  don't think any of us will be sending David Tingen a P.M. About that cuz we don't give a shit.

I guess that explains why some of you are constantly bringing up TOB and its flaws.

 


Uh yeah...that would be BECAUSE WE CAN!

addtocart wrote: Unless I mis-remember, the people at Lakeside Crime said they would not post unless an official report to police had been made.  To keep the reporting of rumors to a minimum.

The people at Lakeside Crime do encourage reporting to the Ministerio, and they provide links and advice to assist you (see the pages listed under "Report a Crime to Authorities"), but an official report is certainly not required in order to report to Lakeside Crime.

Revenge is typical in Mexico and other Central American countries. Several years ago there was a brutal murder of a young lady in her condo, in New York City. She had asked a construction crew to please lower the music, as her baby was asleep. When they did not, she went back upstairs to the apartment (which was in process of renovation), and said please lower other wize i have to call police. They came down and killed her. They confessed after being arrested, they said they were afraid of police reporting them to immigration. Also many crews in Ajijic hire boys who are on the drug methadrine. Some of these boys are from the area, but not all. My landlord knows this. He is mexican. I say this as it is a stong possiblity that someone from the crew did this.

To be honest, I don't know why they are wasting money (other than to impress NOB's.) flying those helicopters to and fro. Get more on-foot police officers. What in the hell can you see from a helicopter unless you are truly chasing someone???
I'm sorry, I just don't get it.

Maybe there are several things going on at the same time?

When in Mexico think like a Mexican :) baking supplies in the candy isle. I'd think they are looking for vehicles and squeezing them out under pressure...defnately many things going on. It's a good thing.

They should always beef up security during festivals since it's common knowledge they bring trouble.

Last Saturday i drove round trip to Tecoman, Colima...couldn't wait to get back into Jalisco. Feds run in convoys of 4-7 trucks over there. At dark we saw one armed military truck. Couldn't get home to Chapala fast enough for me. There's been a lot going on the past few weeks. We had a nice break.

Just don't remember this sort of activity, especially the helicopters for sometime, especially during the Carnival. Thank you for not bashing me. I sometimes live in a fantasy world. Yes indeed we have had a nice break.

This morning the police rounded up all of the car wash guys on the Avenida in Chapala for a little Q&A and we have not seen hide nor hair of them since.

The helicopter serves several purposes - not the least of which is PR.

I can only repeat: They are professionals; let them work. Progress is being made.

There was a vehicle found in the barrio of Tlachichilco this morning with it's tires slashed. A police helicopter was circling the area overhead for about half an hour and there was a lot of police activity near the school. Was this one of the vehicles taken from La Floresta?

Ms.Thang wrote:Chapala, the new one on Pepe Guizar and the one at the Pemex on the way out of town...that is the word on the street, don't have an official source

please keep us updated on the possible oxxo robberies - we assume it is true - but can't find anything online - eg twitter etc

[quote="Axixic"]The helicopter serves several purposes - not the least of which is PR.

I can only repeat: They are professionals; let them work. Progress is being made.
[/quote]

Axixic, I understand. It's just I haven't seen this much activity for a long time. Will not question their motives.

After flying in helicopters for a living for around 18 years, I can tell you that if you have trained eyes, you can see more than you think.

You will never know the motives. Just go on living your life. We still do not know who did the murder, we may never know. What is strange is no one heard anything from the house. What time of night did this occur?

addtocart wrote:
Unless I mis-remember, the people at Lakeside Crime said they would not post unless an official report to police had been made.  To keep the reporting of rumors to a minimum.

Awhile back we adopted a policy that we would only  publish report for activities that COULD be reported to the police and a report COULD be filed with the ministerio.  That was because we sometimes got reports for things like rude behavior - which I don't think the police would consider a crime.  As for REQUIRING that people contact police, that is way beyond our scope.

And prior to this police chief, I don't think there was any point to calling them after the fact - as, their role is only for crimes in process - not after the fact.  However, with the new police chief, we have heard that he wants to hear after the fact - so that he can take that into consideration when scheduling patrols. So you are only helping him with potential crime prevention.

And of course, we encourage everyone to file a report with the ministerio.  And we also realize that many make the decision not to do so based on the ministerio's reputation for putting the bad guys in jail - or not.  You also need to jump through some hoops to prove something was stolen - like having a receipt or witness.  A good idea is to take out your camera at day light savings time start and end and take pictures of valuable items.  Then put them online - like picassa or something - and put your receipts in a special place.

Seventyseven wrote:You will never know the motives. Just go on living your life. We still do not know who did the murder, we may never know. What is strange is no one heard anything from the house. What time of night did this occur?

We may never know the motives - but the police likely will. I don't feel that they are obliged to share that information unless they think there is some public benefit to be gained. THAT is their call. I am comfortable with that.

However I feel confident that we WILL know WHO did the murders although that information is cold comfort. We can only take solace in knowing they have been identified and dealt with - whatever 'dealt with' entails.

If you know the area at all you will realize that it is not the least bit surprising that nothing significant was heard from the house. Forensics apparently have established that the incident occurred around 1:00 AM.

It is quiet there at night, unless there is a party. Daytime can be noisy with garden machines and building. If it was 1 a.m. people could hear broken glass. Most likely the sounds were minimal. It would be best to know who the criminals are. I hope they were not with the construction crew. Too bad the victims did not have better security.

[quote="little italy"]
To be honest, I don't know why they are wasting money (other than to impress   NOB's.) flying those helicopters to and fro. Get more on-foot police officers.


Maybe because Michoacan starts on the other side of the lake ???

If they arrest the criminals their names will be published so we will know who they are (if they are locals). No sure why that is important since they will be out of commission for a while and wether they are construction workers or gang members or both does not make a whole lot of difference in the long run..

A lot of speculation on who the perps were- my first impression, on seeing the house under construction directly adjacent and not even knowing it was vacant- was that it was workers on that jobsite. It is a given that crimes follow constuction sites. I was warned of this by my Mexican lawyer neighbor when I first arrived and was doing major renos on my home. I had as many as a dozen workers on my property 6 days a week for over 2 years. Didn't take them long to figure out I was a single gringa living alone there. Nothing happened while they were working, but after- someone tried poisoning my dogs by throwing little baggies over my wall- 9 in all. All were found in my dog run- only people who'd been on the property knew what & where it was & where to throw the poison. Luckily, I wasn't using the run so my dogs didn't get any. I showed my housekeeper and she told me I was being set up for a robbery once the dogs were killed off. I immediately upped my security- added electric fencing over the spiked wall, motion sensor floodlighting and cameras around the exterior perimeter. No problems since. My place is like bloody Alcatraz.

The point of all this: as previously stated, yes, quite possibly just robbery was the motive, but revenge plays a huge part as well. I fired one crew for gross incompetance, later fired a gardener who threatened to get even. I have no doubt who tried to kill my dogs. Anytime you say or do anything that affects the livelihood or the perceived integrity of a person, you risk retaliation. Does that mean you should keep a worker on who is ripping you off? No, but do take extra precautions, keep notes in case there is trouble later. It is a very different world than many of us are used to.

Milena wrote:Anytime you say or do anything that affects the livelihood or the perceived integrity of a person, you risk retaliation. Does that mean you should keep a worker on who is ripping you off? No, but do take extra precautions, keep notes in case there is trouble later. It is a very different world than many of us are used to.

Not sure it's so different here. On my last job in the USA my manager had to fire two guys (at different times) and both gave him no-so-veiled threats, like "Let's just say you'd better watch your back in the parking lot if you fire me." (Nothing happened, but they were scary threats.) And remember the origin of the phrase "going postal"? What about "road rage"? This crime is awful enough without adding broad cultural slurs. There are vengeful and violent people everywhere.

That said, I have to say I find it more horrifying that this may have happened due to a complaint over animal abuse than that they were random victims of vicious thugs. To suffer like this for defending a helpless, innocent animal...? It's beyond horrible.

I didn't know the victims but they sound like they were really wonderful people and my heart goes out to their friends and family. Such a tragic loss.

Milena is absolutely correct...
The tipping point for aberant behavior in the situations she described is so touchy and volatile that one can never let their guard down.
I know over reaction happens all over the world, such as the Florida cop killing the guy in the theatre for texting, but here there are other factors that one has to be aware of.
A single foreign woman taking to task construction workers for alomost anything is going to create the embryo for a possible retaliation. Someone losing employment, even more so.
Rethink how to handle situations such as animal abuse or any other complaint with a different approach rather than confrontational.
We don't know for sure if this is what happened here, but even if it didn't, everyone can learn lessons, and look for (bad metaphor), a different way to skin a cat.

Sometimes minding ones own business is good common sense.

It is unrealistic to think that anyone who did not grow up within a specific culture will understand where the lines are drawn. I can no more know the real culture here than I could if I moved into Appalachia or the deep south where those Duck Dynasty guys live. I can only hope to find a acceptable middle ground for my own behavior.

These most recent incidents has caused friends to discuss the old refrain of "we have so much they have so little" which has nothing to do with anything other than temptation. The majority of people resist temptation because of values. Occasionally values are superceded by need.

I understand the reason behind needing to find a motive. If there is no motive there is abject fear. Perfectly understandable.

Unless it involves our personal safety minding your own business is always safest.