Re: Statement from Joaquin Huerta en La Pagina

by CheenaGringo Tue Apr 02, 2013 7:13 pm

When it comes to the proponents of legalizing drugs, I have to question just how much experience they have in living in countries where these drugs are either outright legal or local policy is super permissive? I see these blanket cries for legalization to remove the problems but I have to wonder what the answers are for designer drugs which haven't even been invented yet?

by seisdedos Tue Apr 02, 2013 7:29 pm

CheenaGringo wrote:When it comes to the proponents of legalizing drugs, I have to question just how much experience they have in living in countries where these drugs are either outright legal or local policy is super permissive? I see these blanket cries for legalization to remove the problems but I have to wonder what the answers are for designer drugs which haven't even been invented yet?

Have you lived in any of those countries? What is your experience which makes you want to question others?

Read this:

http://www.globalcommissionondrugs.org/wp-content/themes/gcdp_v1/pdf/Global_Commission_Report_English.pdf

and this:

http://www.globalcommissionondrugs.org/wp-content/themes/gcdp_v1/pdf/Global_Commission_Report_English.pdf

by CheenaGringo Tue Apr 02, 2013 7:45 pm

Seis:

No reason to get all that defensive but FYI, living for extended periods in the Philippines and India may have provided me with a slightly different outlook? On top of those experiences, visiting/viewing opium dens in Hong Kong in the 50's and viewing rampant drug use in Kashmir & Nepal in the 60's might just have given me a different outlook?

Unlike others, I do not claim that my theories are correct but I believe I do have the foundation to question!

by seisdedos Tue Apr 02, 2013 7:56 pm

CheenaGringo wrote:Seis:

No reason to get all that defensive but FYI, living for extended periods in the Philippines and India may have provided me with a slightly different outlook? On top of those experiences, visiting/viewing opium dens in Hong Kong in the 50's and viewing rampant drug use in Kashmir & Nepal in the 60's might just have given me a different outlook?

Unlike others, I do not claim that my theories are correct but I believe I do have the foundation to question!

And drugs are legal or permitted in those countries? I spent some time in SE Asia and have been inside opium dens. How about living in a present day situation where things are rapidly deteriorating and the criminals are now the ones running the country? I'll take a stoned out junkie over a 18 year old with a AK-47 killing innocent people and putting their heads on display like a 12 pt. mule deer.

by Ms.Thang Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:08 pm

Just curious, how much jail time do you suppose an illegle gun would actually get a person in mexico?

by CheenaGringo Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:12 pm

Seis:

Just in case you may be jumping to some conclusion that my opinions are based upon some wacko political belief, I can assure you that this isn't the case! My beliefs were developed through personal experience but in no way do I think others should believe the same. I might question the motivation behind the statements of others but you will never see me stating that others have to follow my way of thinking!

by seisdedos Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:17 pm

Ms.Thang wrote: Just curious, how much jail time do you suppose an illegle gun would actually get a person in mexico?

Depends on the weapon. If it is a legal caliber but the person doesn't have it registered its 2 to 7 years but if it is a caliber reserved solely for the armed forces the sentence is much longer.

by hockables Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:34 pm

Dr. Sam Thelin wrote:1. The narcos can quit while they are ahead. That has happened in Colombia where many have taken the profits and invested it into businesses. This will not appeal to new narcos that are still looking for easy money.

2. The USA can decriminalize drugs, and treat addiction as a medical problem. This would be good in the long run, but will involve money shifted from law enforcement to rehabilitation treatment. This will not lower the demand in Mexico unless other countries do the same. Mexico now is one of the leading, if not the leading supplier of drugs to Europe.

3. Mexico cannot yet decriminalize drugs becuase it will have a retaliation that will be more than the government can handle. There are already attacks on rehab clinics, and people forced to sell drugs.

4. More people at risk should be permitted to have hand guns. There is an NRA saying that states "When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns," and we see this in Mexico. Not every drunk Mexican should have one, but when people do not have the right to defend themselves, the outlaws have easier targets. As it is now in Mexico, if an innocent victim shoots and kills a narco, it is murder becuase the gun was not a legal gun. To legally carry a gun in Mexico requires money ($4000mxn per year) and special permission with great restrictions.

I've never met a Red-Neck Doctor...
I thought these guys might be unjustly criticising you.... maybe not............

by Ms.Thang Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:00 pm

A couple of months after that huge shootout that started in front of Spencers place a while back I was VERY surprised to see that this guy was arrested...he is someone I know pretty well.

http://miradainformativa.com/2011/12/04/detenido-con-arma-y-droga-habria-participado-en-enfrentamiento-en-chapala/

I was even more surprised to see him strolling around Soriana about 8 months after he was arrested.

We never hear about what happens to these guys after they go to jail. It was really interesting to know just for once.

by viajero Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:39 pm

Amazing isn't it?The justice system here is a real piece of work.

by Dr. Sam Thelin Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:57 pm

Ms.Thang wrote: Just curious, how much jail time do you suppose an illegle gun would actually get a person in mexico?

Not sure the time. Maybe 5 years... could be more. However, Mexican jail is not nice. I know many ex convicts in Mexico as patients from servicio. Not a pretty site.

by CheenaGringo Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:03 pm

That would be "sight" wouldn't it be maroon?

by viajero Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:05 pm

It was just a typo Neil.lol

by Dr. Sam Thelin Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:07 pm

seisdedos wrote:
Ms.Thang wrote: Just curious, how much jail time do you suppose an illegle gun would actually get a person in mexico?

Depends on the weapon. If it is a legal caliber but the person doesn't have it registered its 2 to 7 years but if it is a caliber reserved solely for the armed forces the sentence is much longer.

That sounds about right. The legal limit being .380

by Dr. Sam Thelin Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:10 pm

CheenaGringo wrote:That would be "sight" wouldn't it be maroon?

Most likely, yes it would be. Thank you Very Happy

by Dr. Sam Thelin Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:24 pm

hockables wrote:
Dr. Sam Thelin wrote:1. The narcos can quit while they are ahead. That has happened in Colombia where many have taken the profits and invested it into businesses. This will not appeal to new narcos that are still looking for easy money.

2. The USA can decriminalize drugs, and treat addiction as a medical problem. This would be good in the long run, but will involve money shifted from law enforcement to rehabilitation treatment. This will not lower the demand in Mexico unless other countries do the same. Mexico now is one of the leading, if not the leading supplier of drugs to Europe.

3. Mexico cannot yet decriminalize drugs becuase it will have a retaliation that will be more than the government can handle. There are already attacks on rehab clinics, and people forced to sell drugs.

4. More people at risk should be permitted to have hand guns. There is an NRA saying that states "When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns," and we see this in Mexico. Not every drunk Mexican should have one, but when people do not have the right to defend themselves, the outlaws have easier targets. As it is now in Mexico, if an innocent victim shoots and kills a narco, it is murder becuase the gun was not a legal gun. To legally carry a gun in Mexico requires money ($4000mxn per year) and special permission with great restrictions.

I've never met a Red-Neck Doctor...
I thought these guys might be unjustly criticising you.... maybe not............

I never actually put the bumper sticker on my car, but I agree with the logic...

by seisdedos Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:33 pm

Dr. Sam Thelin wrote:
seisdedos wrote:
Ms.Thang wrote: Just curious, how much jail time do you suppose an illegle gun would actually get a person in mexico?

Depends on the weapon. If it is a legal caliber but the person doesn't have it registered its 2 to 7 years but if it is a caliber reserved solely for the armed forces the sentence is much longer.

That sounds about right. The legal limit being .380

Its 5 to 10 for a sidearm reserved solely for use by the military and 10 to 15 for anything else such as military type weapons. Assault rifles, machine guns etc.

by viajero Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:44 pm

Dr. Sam Thelin wrote: I never actually put the bumper sticker on my car, but I agree with the logic...

Are you talking about the one the NRA sent you when you renewed your membership?
Do you really think that easy access to legal firearms would in anyway decrease the level of violence here?

by viajero Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:47 pm

seisdedos wrote:

Its 5 to 10 for a sidearm reserved solely for use by the military and 10 to 15 for anything else such as military type weapons. Assault rifles, machine guns etc.

I wonder how much time they actually serve,on average.

by seisdedos Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:18 pm

I imagine each case is different. Years ago at the coast, a local bad guy forced his way into a rec vehicle owned by a couple of elderly foreigners. The guy put a knife to the man's throat and the old lady pulled out a handgun and shot him dead. The cops were called and the poor woman was hauled off to jail in Cihuatlan. She wasn't charged withe the killing, it was ruled justifiable but they did charge her with arms possession.

Her husband was allowed to park their trailer near the local jail and prepare her meals and enjoyed very liberal visiting privileges. The local authorities, judge, jailers, MP and cops etc were all very sympathetic to her to case. The bad guy had been in and out of jail many times prior to this incident and they admired her balls for blowing him away. Anyway, she was allowed to post bail and they all told the couple to just get in their RV and head for the border. It went without saying they should never return.

by slainte39 Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:25 pm

viajero wrote:
Dr. Sam Thelin wrote: I never actually put the bumper sticker on my car, but I agree with the logic...
Are you talking about the one the NRA sent you when you renewed your membership?
Do you really think that easy access to legal firearms would in anyway decrease the level of violence here?

Is there a NRA organization or something like it here in Mexico? If so, never heard of it, although I have known a few skeet and trap shooters, Can't see the value of it with the strict gun laws here.....and the criminals sure don't need NRA support to carry weapons.

by Intercasa Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:04 am

Many, many attorneys have guns. I am not yet a member of that elite group but it comes up in conversation and many have guns, even prohibited calibers as well as their bodyguards. I love guns but don't want to have to feel the need to carry one for protection.

by slainte39 Wed Apr 03, 2013 1:01 am

I know more people here in Mexico that own gun/guns, than don't. The difference is they keep that info close to their breast and don't run around, unlike in the U. S., screaming that it's their first ammendment right...and as far as I know, they are not committing crimes.

by Intercasa Wed Apr 03, 2013 8:12 am

First or second amendment right?

by slainte39 Wed Apr 03, 2013 11:40 am

Intercasa wrote:First or second amendment right?

You're right Spencer....2nd amendment rights for the firearms....1st amendment rights for the screaming. Very Happy

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