ROOF PAINTING TIME

We have an old, old house with a flat roof. It heats up. Any improvement will of course be most welcome.

It's that time again. You know, when the 5 year roof coating gives way to cracks here and there at around three years. Or less. Anyway, our Mexican neighbor and house/roof painter who will be doing it this year (different guys last time) tells me that if we use white paint instead of the usual terra cotta color, the house will be at least 10 degrees cooler. Anybody had experience with this?

A light colored roof will definitely reflect the light and heat resulting in a cooler interior. Some progressive communities NOB are making light colored roof coatings, light colored tile or light colored shingles the new building code for this very reason.

That is why all the tops of the school buses are painted white on top as
it lowers the heat compared to school bus yellow in hot areas like california.

Z

We've tried the white. It gets much hotter than the red, and breaks down much more quickly.

HelperGuy wrote:We've tried the white. It gets much hotter than the red, and breaks down much more quickly.

What brand of white stuff and what was it called?

gringal wrote:We have an old, old house with a flat roof. It heats up. Any improvement will of course be most welcome.

It's that time again. You know, when the 5 year roof coating gives way to cracks here and there at around three years. Or less. Anyway, our Mexican neighbor and house/roof painter who will be doing it this year (different guys last time) tells me that if we use white paint instead of the usual terra cotta color, the house will be at least 10 degrees cooler. Anybody had experience with this?

Who are you thinking of using to do this job? It's not any painter that can do this. A special procedure MUST be followed and a certain number of coats must be put on. You need to ask lots of questions:
1. How will they prepare the roof (by grinding scraping, power washing)? It needs to be done as I described in parentheses.

2. Are they going to use membrane? Depends on whether it's a boveda or flat roof. The membrane makes the material MUCH stronger, but it takes more time to do, ie: more costly.

3. Will they bring the roof material up the sides of the parapet to the top edge of the roof? Should be done.

4. What material do they want to use? Fester is THE best and more costly, but you can use Casther, about half the price? Example: Fester Acriton 10 year is about $ 1800 pesos a cubeta (5 gal). Casther 7 year is $ 1,020. pesos a cubeta (5 gal).
You can check all the prices yourself.

5. How many year product will he use, 5 yr, 7 yr or 10 year?

6. You are going to be here forever and don't want to do this for 10 years, so use 10 year material. Don't let ANYONE tell you that it will not last for close to 10 years because it will. My roof was originally done with 7 year Fester Acriton the correct way and it lasted 9 years!

7. If you have done your roof in the past and it didn't last at least 5 years, it was never done correctly. If your roof or parapet wall needs patching, he can do that too.

8. I highly recommend you use:
Enrique Pineda
Cell phone: 045 333 440 6364

Reasonably priced and stands in back of his work. He just did ny roof and my neighbors roof. He will be doing one of my dinner groups roofs next week. He does most all the painting in Los Arroyos and Los Arroyos Sur.

gringal wrote:

HelperGuy wrote:We've tried the white. It gets much hotter than the red, and breaks down much more quickly.

What brand of white stuff and what was it called?

Sorry, too long ago to remember. Did it with the aid of a contractor.

When I ran a warehouses in Los Angeles we used to put white gravel on the roof to keep tthe building cooler and it did work.

All I recall for sure is that many of us at the time agreed that, with our basic knowledge of science and physics, white should be the perfect colour. After, I looked around at practically every rooftop in Mexico and southern California and wondered why they were all red stuff or tile. I had assumed that tile was terracotta because that's the way the mud comes. Nope, it just seems to work.

Here is what you need to ask your Contractors so they bid apples to apples and you will get a good job. November thru May is the best weather for roof work. Weather and surfaces MUST be dry.

ROOF SPECIFICATIONS (For Fester Acriton and Other Brands)
1. Scrape and grind all loose material and rough areas. Clean using a power washer, otherwise Fester Acriton will not adhere.

2. Check all loose roof tiles. Remove loose roof tiles, inspect for cracks, repair and recement roof tiles.

3. IMPORTANT: Put a very thin concrete only cement wash over the roof tiles,
otherwise the Fester Acriton will not bond.

4. Optional: Apply Fester Festerbond to roof. (This is a high quality bonding agent)

5. Apply a thinned down coat of Fester Acriton 50% Acriton & 50% clean water to the roof for the first coat ONLY. Lay Membrane into this Fester Acriton. Put on another coat of Fester Acriton, without thinning, immediateky over the membrane.

6. Apply FOUR more coats of Fester Acriton as it comes from the bucket, without
thinning, on the roof on different days, allowing each coat to dry.

7. Your Contractor should give you at least a 7 year Guarantee and better yet a 10 year Guarantee. You should check his references and talk to others he has done roofs for.

PAINTING & ROOF COATING - 5 YEAR PAINT GUARANTEE - THE BEST PAINTER
ENRIQUE PINEDA (Speaks perfect English)
Cell ph: 045 333 440 6364

MAESTRO - CONST - REMODEL - TILE - ELECTRICAL - PLUMBING - Highly Rec
RAYMUNDO BLAS PINEDA (Speaks English) - Written Estimates - Reasonable Prices
Cell ph: 045 331 141 5638
constructionsray@hotmail.com

Highly recommended Contractor:
MAESTRO - Construction - Remodel - Roofs - Tile - Pools - Painting
(He Guarantees his work.)
RUBEN “CHINO” CHAVARRIA (Speaks English)
Francisco Villa # 11 - Ajijic
Tel: 766 2327
Cell ph: 045 333 150 9031

John: yes, we used the membrane and followed all the procedures you mentioned. Our painter knows what he's doing. We will be using the expensive stuff. Etc.

However, there are differences between your situation and ours. One is the age and the constant settling of the house. We are speaking of a multitude of rehabs, additions and changes to a place that was part of the original hacienda and parts of it are probably well over 150 years old. Definitely not todays construction. For instance, the last earthquake solved the leaky fountain problem, but now the bathroom door sticks. It just comes with the territory. This probably doesn't help the integrity of the roof. The leaks kind of move around.
However, we love the old wreck. It's patch, patch, patch.......at our age, and at that of our casa.

My only real question was about the color. Logic suggests that the light roof would be cooler.......like our current white car is cooler than the black one we used to have.

Helper Guy:

While I won't dispute your experience with Brand X Mexican red roof coating and Brand Y white roof coating, science and practical knowledge indicates that your assumptions are incorrect. Red or terracota was applied to give homes a certain look during a period when energy conservation and effectiveness were rarely considered. Since Gringal stated a flat roof, I will use Albuquerque as a comparison since the altitude and heat factors are very similar to those at the Lake. For years, flat roofs hidden by the parapets were most often covered with black tar and gravel. The thinking was that the light colored gravel was sufficient to reflect the heat but these roofs do absorb the heat during the hot summer months and it does transfer into the interior of homes. We have two townhouses on one side and another on the other side of us who have all switched to a light colored (white or gray) roof coating on flat roofs with very similar floor plans and similar window orientation. All three are much cooler than ours with a black tar and gravel coating.

CG - 1000% correct.

Go with the white covering,it's a no brainer.

Sounds like the majority favor the idea of a light roof coating, along with us and our roof coater.

We will report on our subjective opinion about the heat when it's finished.

Geesh, it's getting warm. 89F here yesterday.
Rainbirds? Hope they're getting it on.

Never used red ... but went from new cement to white and it's definitely cooler. 5-10 degrees ??

CheenaGringo wrote:Helper Guy:

While I won't dispute your experience with Brand X Mexican red roof coating and Brand Y white roof coating, science and practical knowledge indicates that your assumptions are incorrect. Red or terracota was applied to give homes a certain look during a period when energy conservation and effectiveness were rarely considered. Since Gringal stated a flat roof, I will use Albuquerque as a comparison since the altitude and heat factors are very similar to those at the Lake. For years, flat roofs hidden by the parapets were most often covered with black tar and gravel. The thinking was that the light colored gravel was sufficient to reflect the heat but these roofs do absorb the heat during the hot summer months and it does transfer into the interior of homes. We have two townhouses on one side and another on the other side of us who have all switched to a light colored (white or gray) roof coating on flat roofs with very similar floor plans and similar window orientation. All three are much cooler than ours with a black tar and gravel coating.

Science? So all these years of red roofing in this country, and all over the lower states, are just bad luck and stupidity? Then I have to feel sorry for these poor people. Especially the ones in the nice, cool houses with the red roofs.

Helper Guy:

I realize that you have tremendous talents with computers according to your numerous satisfied customers. A bit of research on the Internet will most definitely back up statements that I have made.

I'm not saying you're wrong. I am saying you're not all correct. I don't know why things are different in different areas; I just know what works when it works.

Rather than speculate as to why things are the way they are, consider this: Most of the early homes had tile roofs, which were that color because that's the way the clay is. Thus, the notion that roofs should match the terra cotta tile.
People tend to keep doing things the way they always have, just because they always have. It's not really about science. Ask yourself why anyone here would want a black car? Having had one, I'd never have one again. Steam chambers. Yet, the top dogs with the clout.........have black cars.

The nice cool houses are usually cool only on the bottom story. Ours is a mostly one story house. The guest suite upstairs is hotter than hades during these months. It also has to do with the thickness of the walls, and whether or not there is a covered terrazza all around the place. Skylights, which made the place pleasant and were installed by previous owners to avoid the dark pit look also contribute to the heat.

So........as a public service, I will be the guinea pig: paint the roof white and report the results.

HelperGuy wrote:I'm not saying you're wrong. I am saying you're not all correct. I don't know why things are different in different areas; I just know what works when it works.

Don't compare a red tile roof with a white painted coating on the roof. A tile roof goes on slatted boards and than there is an air
space than below is the insulation above the ceiling. White stuff goes directly on your roof and ceiling which is one mass. I found
the best roof is a solid metal roof with a tile roof on top of it. Always nice and cool underneath maybe for the reason HG has
noticed. No leaks and no horrible loud sound of a metal roof during the rain.

Z

Agreed.

Zedinmexico wrote:

HelperGuy wrote:I'm not saying you're wrong. I am saying you're not all correct. I don't know why things are different in different areas; I just know what works when it works.

Don't compare a red tile roof with a white painted coating on the roof. A tile roof goes on slatted boards and than there is an air
space than below is the insulation above the ceiling. White stuff goes directly on your roof and ceiling which is one mass. I found
the best roof is a solid metal roof with a tile roof on top of it. Always nice and cool underneath maybe for the reason HG has
noticed. No leaks and no horrible loud sound of a metal roof during the rain.

Z

The air space idea was used back in some of the "hippie" housebuilding days when people were coming up with great ways to keep a house warm in the winter and cool in the summer, especially off the grid. An old friend built one up in Sonoma county. Amazingly comfortable.

I have a new angled awning (marquesina) that I'm probably going to put the curved tiles on 'for looks' but unless they are sealed upper and lower they become homes for all kinds of critters.

What is the percentage of houses here that have angled roofs with tile. Mostly it small sections for looks or awnings/garages

The white definitely does keep the house cooler. The roof on the house we are renting in Riviera Alta just was done in February. It was terracotta before and now is white. Today was the first day I put the fan in the bedroom on low.
John's information about Fester is, IMHO, bang on. When we re-did the roof of our house in San Pancho (five years after construction), we used 10 year Fester Acriton and a membrane and John's instructions. The contractor we used said he had never seen a thicker or better impermabilizante...icky stuff to work with but more than does the job.