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Mexican president Pena Nieto to overhaul police

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Post by arbon on Fri Nov 28, 2014 3:19 am

The overhaul would begin in Mexico's four most violent states, he said - Tamaulipas, Jalisco, Michoacan and Guerrero.

Mexican President Enrique Pena Nieto has announced plans to overhaul the country's municipal police forces after the disappearance of 43 students.

He plans to put all local police units under federal control.

In a televised speech, President Pena Nieto said that "Mexico must change".

He announced proposals for a series of constitutional reforms that would allow the country's 1,800 municipal forces to be dissolved and taken over by state agencies.

The reforms would also enable Congress to dissolve local governments infiltrated by drug cartels.

The overhaul would begin in Mexico's four most violent states, he said - Tamaulipas, Jalisco, Michoacan and Guerrero.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-30239433
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Post by Mainecoons on Fri Nov 28, 2014 5:41 am

They can start with Chapala municipality.

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Post by sampati on Fri Nov 28, 2014 5:58 am

I am not so sure that the Federales are much better than the municipal police. Pena Nieto has his work cut out for him but I hope it works for the betterment of the country and the Mexican people.
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Post by jle on Fri Nov 28, 2014 6:48 am

I agree with Sampati that the federal police may even be worse than the local police.

Yesterday, my Mexican boyfriend who is born and raised in Ajijic was at the Malacon having his usual walk. As he returned to the car, which was parked in the malacon lot. Three black federal police trucks came and approx 10 officers got out. Because he was wearing sunglasses, they accused him of being high on pot etc and being cartel. He is 50 years old, does not smoke pot and is not cholo looking at all. When they asked him questions and he answered one cop would  punch him in the stomach and tell him to shut up. This happened three times. They searched his body and the car and of course found nothing...They had the car keys and his wallet on the trunk of the car. Then they told him to get the hell out of there. They would not let him get his belongings. He walked away and returned in about 10 minutes to get the car and get home. A friend of his who saw this happening got the keys and his wallet off of the car when the police left. Of course the 100 pesos that he had in his wallet the police took. His only crime was wearing sunglasses. Now I understand why he HATES the police in Mexico.

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Post by kb9gzg on Fri Nov 28, 2014 9:20 am

Now, that is just plain creepy. If the police (of all stripes) cannot be trusted to do their work in a civilized manner, who is left to serve and protect? Is it possible that lawlessness is the norm, and that my relatives' anxiety about our spending time in any part of Mexico is based upon reality?
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Post by Playaboy on Fri Nov 28, 2014 9:23 am

Protect and Serve? Depends on the color of your skin.

With most Mexican Police there is a double standard.  White gringo rarely see the side that brown locals see.  Kind of like the USA.

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Post by brigitte on Fri Nov 28, 2014 9:45 am

Consolidation of local and Sate  police under a Federal Police is a dangerous move, one step closer to a dictatorship. Nothing good can come out of this one. It is removing state rights, a dangerous thing for the people.

Yes the police cannot be trusted, some are good some are bad and as a group they can be bad news..There is a reason most Mexicans do not trust the police.

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Post by CanuckBob on Fri Nov 28, 2014 10:45 am

kb9gzg wrote:Now, that is just plain creepy. If the police (of all stripes) cannot be trusted to do their work in a civilized manner, who is left to serve and protect? Is it possible that lawlessness is the norm, and that my relatives' anxiety about our spending time in any part of Mexico is based upon reality?

I think most gringos in Mexico, whether you live here or just visiting, are looked upon as "tourists" (maybe a bit less so in this area). If you keep your nose clean and mind your own business I doubt you will ever have anything to worry about with the policia. Of course you may not likely get any more help from them than the locals do if you need them to "serve or protect"........
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Post by CHILLIN on Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:12 am

This wanders off a little bit - but I wonder if all countries have this stage in the evolution of their police departments. I am thinking particularly of the U.K., when in the sixties, and many years before, if you were a tough kid, then you had to choose the side of law and order, or the side of professional criminals. The dividing line was often very thin. The police on the beats were often bullies, provoking encounters. Their attitude was "if you think we are treating you badly now, for something you did not do, guess what is going to happen to you if you DO get caught breaking the law?"

Luckily, there is always a core of hardworking, honest police, and leaders who seek genuine improvement.
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Post by slainte39 on Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:14 am

In any situation or event, it would be apropos to hear both sides before passing judgment or coming to a conclusion .
As far as EPN and his announcement, it seems some believe the status quo might be better even though it's not working satisfactorily.

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Post by slainte39 on Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:27 am

CHILLIN wrote:This wanders off a little bit - but I wonder if all countries have this stage in the evolution of their police departments. I am thinking particularly of the U.K., when in the sixties, and many years before, if you were a tough kid, then you had to choose the side of law and order, or the side of professional criminals. The dividing line was often very thin. The police on the beats were often bullies, provoking encounters. Their attitude was "if you think we are treating you badly now, for something you did not do, guess what is going to happen to you if you DO get caught breaking the law?"

Luckily, there is always a core of hardworking, honest police, and leaders who seek genuine improvement.

If anyone would like to see the slow evolution of police forces in a first world country, namely the USA, get a copy of the DVD, or somehow watch the fine Canadian/CBC series "Coppers", set in  NYC but filmed in Toronto.
The US still has it's problems, as witnessed in Missouri and other places. It's tough to get it right, but "El Presidente" has to do something.

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Post by Fastfox on Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:54 am

Centralized government gets more and more power and more abusive. It's never a good thing.

Best if people have the skills and ability to defend themselves. You can never rely on someone else for protection. Each person would otherwise need a body guard.
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Post by brigitte on Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:57 am

The bobbies in the UK in the sixties and before did not carry firearms just a big stick, big difference...

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Post by otrocanuck on Fri Nov 28, 2014 12:27 pm

Check out the topic below: "Amazing story in Mexico of self governing community" that is an interesting option as to what can be done?
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Post by bimini6 on Fri Nov 28, 2014 1:20 pm

Hope and Change, we have all heard this mantra before……..(well, maybe not the Canadians) Federales are just as corrupt and the narcos target the top 10 in every federale class to recruit for their benefit. They pay them while in class to get them hooked.

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Post by Oldyfeliz on Fri Nov 28, 2014 3:01 pm

It was the State(Fuerza Unica) and Federal Police that beat the Students , robbed them of computers, cell phones, money, etc , 2 nites ago on the Sta. Rosa/Ocotlan Hghy.
And then took one of the two buses and made them walk to Antequiza School.
A very long distance

I think this will take all of the power from locals, put it in the power of the State,
and then the Narcos only have to pay the State. The money that was/is going to the locals will then go into State officials hands

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Post by Pedro on Fri Nov 28, 2014 6:27 pm

why don't you post this stough in the proper forum
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Post by slainte39 on Fri Nov 28, 2014 7:18 pm

otrocanuck wrote:Check out the topic below: "Amazing story in Mexico of self governing community" that is an interesting option as to what can be done?

I don't think that is necessarily the road to a Utopian government.  Wasn't Iguala, in  fact, a self governing community, and we see how that turned out. Birmingham, AL was a self governing community in the 60's, until the Federal government stepped in.
The quality of the, whoever is in charge government, is more important than whether it is localized, federalized, centralized, or any other "ized".  It can go both ways.

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Post by Oldyfeliz on Fri Nov 28, 2014 8:03 pm

You may be right , but it is much better than the Iguala as we have come to know. And this one will probably follow in Iguala's path without arms to defend itself This statement will open up another subject, but how is a Citizenry defend itself against
a tyrannical Gov't/narcos without the right to bear arns?
Proof of this, is the situation with Dr Mireles in Michoacán with the AutoDefencias.

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Post by viajero on Fri Nov 28, 2014 9:13 pm

Oldyfeliz wrote:You may be right , but it is much better than the Iguala as we have come to know.  And this one will probably follow in Iguala's path without arms to defend itself  This statement will open up another subject, but how is a Citizenry defend itself against
a tyrannical Gov't/narcos without the right to bear arns?
Sundown/oldinfeliz,are you suggesting that the"Citizenry" rise up in arms and overthrow this "tyrannical"government?

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Post by Pedro on Fri Nov 28, 2014 9:20 pm

mexicans can own guns as can ferners here. read the laws.
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Post by slainte39 on Fri Nov 28, 2014 10:18 pm

Oldyfeliz wrote:You may be right , but it is much better than the Iguala as we have come to know.

Wasn't the problem in Iguala, too much local control, i.e., the mayor and his wife.
Locals, mayors and police chiefs can be as much a problem being despots as can be federal presidents and dictators.

Who is going to vet the vettors?  Nationwide revolution? Throwing out the baby with the bath water isn't a solution.
Do you want no government, no constitution? Are you going to pick the next leaders at the local or federal level? Is anarchy the solution?
Most people on these web boards, including me, don't even know what questions to ask, let alone supply the answers.

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Post by Oldyfeliz on Fri Nov 28, 2014 10:48 pm

"Sundown/oldinfeliz,are you suggesting that the"Citizenry" rise up in arms and overthrow this "tyrannical"government?"

I would suggest that the Police is part of the Gov't and is tyrannical , when it is killing their young people! Beating them when they protest, which their constitution gives them the right to do. And when you are stopped on the highway and have to give them money, etc, etc, .
No I did not advocate overthrow , but how can the People protect themselves?
Dr Moreles and the Autodefenses proved that it can be done, and hundreds aof these Autodefenses are in prison along with Dr Moreles

Now the Federales are picking up the peaceful Student protesters and taking them to prison with no bail, and more, and more..

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Post by viajero on Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:06 pm

slainte39 wrote:
Most people on these web boards, including me, don't even know what questions to ask, let alone supply the answers.
Amen to that,amigo.

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