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Post by Vandre on Wed Jan 21, 2015 1:14 pm

I visited my Prop Mgmt Co yesterday and credited $$ to my acct for annual prop tax and water charges.  I brought 25% more $$ than last years charges after reading the webboards, because I did not know what my 2015 bills would be.  The staff were able to bring up 2015 amounts due.  And, in my case, the prop tax due is same as last year.  And, water bill was ~200p more (& INCLUDES a 1500p charge for a water meter).. The Mgmt Co. owner got on the phone with SIMAPA and they supposedly said that all "large" properties MUST now have their water metered.  What the definition of large is ...... I don't know. My 2015 bill was 29,578 pesos

I have no idea how much water I use.  I am frugal, as is my nature (metered or non-metered ((because there is always electric w/sump pump & pressure pump costs too)).  For 9+ years I have simply accepted that this is what it will cost me for this service.  It looks like I have no choice in the matter and that it WILL BE metered today or tomorrow, whether I want it or not.  Mgmt Co did say that one of their clients (with prop similar to mine) went metered last year and their 2014 charges were 20% less than the year before.  So, who knows??  Is their prop really similar to mine? who knows??  Prop Mgr. also said (since I elected to pay the full 2015 bill) that should the metered costs be less than the amount paid, credit would carry over to 2016.  Who knows? Prop Mgr. also said the tiers say that the more you used - the lower the rate per liter/gal.  Which makes no sense whatsoever.

I had considered installing a meter on the inside to get a handle on exactly how much water I was using, so as to be informed before I opted for a meter.  Looks like that is no longer an option for me.

I was given a website to go to, but have been unable to get a connect.  The address is www.periodocooficial.jalisco.gob.mx, then go to Ley de Ingresos, then go to (she wasn't sure which) CNA/SIAPA/SIMAPA ...to find out the pricing tiers.  Maybe someone else has faster connection speeds and can get to the website.

She also said that Water is now or will be shortly a FEDERAL service, rather than a local one, as in the past.  Who knows?

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Post by Mainecoons on Wed Jan 21, 2015 2:29 pm

Exactly right.  The pool cover cuts the evaporation tremendously.

We were at 7500 pesos last year.  You got room to run there CBob. Very Happy

They seem to charge more if you have more bathrooms, despite the fact that if you have 10 bathrooms but only 2 people living in a house the bathrooms won't consume any more than if there are 3 of them.

I reckon if they want us to get a meter, they'll tell us. I'm not volunteering for one. Among other things, when they send a slug of mud down the pipe I could see the thing getting plugged up pretty quick. Meters are good for steady and clean water, that sure isn't what we're getting delivered here.

I'm skeptical that water is going to be Federal but I could see it ending up being state.

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Post by solajijic on Wed Jan 21, 2015 3:36 pm

Our previous house in west Ajijic had water bills ranging in 2004 at $4500 pesos to 2012 at $9200 pesos. We had a large garden lawn area but had also turned several large areas into patios etc. So we had Simapa out to measure twice over the years and never had a reduction in the bill.

At this in village house we eliminated a full bath in favor of a kitchen pantry. That reduced the bill 15%.

The house next door to us has no garden at all 2 beds and 2 baths and their bill is $1750. Even though I can prove to Simapa that no one lives in that property 50% of the year.

So who knows.



So who knows.

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Post by hank chance on Wed Jan 21, 2015 3:43 pm

Mainecoons wrote:
They seem to charge more if you have more bathrooms, despite the fact that if you have 10 bathrooms but only 2 people living in a house the bathrooms won't consume any more than if there are 3 of them.



They know if you have 10 bathrooms. How do they know there are really only 2 people living in a house? You talk all kinds of crap.

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Post by brigitte on Wed Jan 21, 2015 4:52 pm

They charge for the potential usage of the house. So if you have 10 bathrooms you could have 10 couples...assuming that you have many bedrooms as well.
In that case I would think it is more economical to be charge according to usage and get a meter this way you get charged for what you get.

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Post by brigitte on Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:18 pm

Solaajijic that is the perfect exemple of how screwy the bills are. That property paid way more for the water than we did and way less for the taxes when they were similar in size.

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Post by brigitte on Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:26 pm

The estimation by Simapa per person per day is 1.5m3, I got that figure from the administrator at Simapa  and I will get a meter because I believe that I can do better with a meter considering I am not here for a portion of the year.
Th administrator confirmed that any property over 250m2 of garden will have to have a meter so it is just a question of time. I think they are not pushing for the meter because they would be swamped but it is coming down the pipe for sure.

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Post by arbon on Wed Jan 21, 2015 6:18 pm

hank chance wrote:
Mainecoons wrote:
They seem to charge more if you have more bathrooms, despite the fact that if you have 10 bathrooms but only 2 people living in a house the bathrooms won't consume any more than if there are 3 of them.



They know if you have 10 bathrooms. How do they know there are really only 2 people living in a house? You talk all kinds of crap.

Mainecoons said he was a qualified "Sanitary Engineer" if that explains his expert opinions,

maybe even in DC.
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Post by Vandre on Wed Jan 21, 2015 7:08 pm

Wow, now that people are actually spelling out what their water bills are, I'm beginning to believe that metering will be a good thing for me !!  If Simapa, to date, has believed that a fair cost is ~$41US/mo (using MCoons as an example with his frequently mentioned large house, multiple ponds, pool and lots of landscaping), it's looking good for those of us that may have larger than average acreage but not as many residents and/or water-need amenities, as their size property implies.

I pay $45US/mo in CA simply to be hooked up to a water line (any water I really do use when I'm there is additional - after some built-in minimum is consumed).  Granted the product received here in no way compares NOB.  Up there I automatically get pressurized clean drinkable water (no need for primary backwashable filter at the street inlet, no need to have a sump pump in the aljibe, no need for a pressure tank, no need for an aljibe, no need for a tinaco for emergencies, no need for carbon/paper/UV light filters AND ...... all the additional costs attributable to them eg. puchase price, installation, maintenance, replacement and CFE expense)  Also, NOB, if they decide on some kind of newfangled smart-type meter - I am not charged for it.

Now the only question is:  how much will they charge here per cu ft/mt2/gal?  And, if after metering everyone, it turns out to produce less income (whomever THEM is), since it has always simply been a guess on their part as to who is REALLY using up the water -- what will THEY do then?  Up the price across the board; identify those that appear they can afford to pay more (#banos, property size; yada-yada) or actually limit usage?  Who knows?  

I reviewed my old water bills and found my largest percentage jumps to be in 2011 and 2012. Anyway MC, I think you've had it pretty good and don't really understand your anger on this subject, I don't think you could live anywhere else and pay as little as you do for the amenities you enjoy. (However, I do understand the shock of a large % increase. That kind of thing can really throw you off your budget), whether it is overdue or not.
Has anyone been able to get onto the site I mentioned earlier to obtain the proposed charges for ltr/gal usage levels?

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Post by Mainecoons on Wed Jan 21, 2015 7:24 pm

hank chance wrote:
Mainecoons wrote:
They seem to charge more if you have more bathrooms, despite the fact that if you have 10 bathrooms but only 2 people living in a house the bathrooms won't consume any more than if there are 3 of them.



They know if you have 10 bathrooms. How do they know there are really only 2 people living in a house? You talk all kinds of crap.

The point being is that they assume more bathrooms, more consumption regardless.  We obviously don't have 10 bathrooms.

Don't be rude.


Last edited by Mainecoons on Wed Jan 21, 2015 7:41 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Post by Mainecoons on Wed Jan 21, 2015 7:29 pm

Vandre wrote:Wow, now that people are actually spelling out what their water bills are, I'm beginning to believe that metering will be a good thing for me !!  If Simapa, to date, has believed that a fair cost is ~$41US/mo (using MCoons as an example with his frequently mentioned large house, multiple ponds, pool and lots of landscaping), it's looking good for those of us that may have larger than average acreage but not as many residents and/or water-need amenities, as their size property implies.

I pay $45US/mo in CA simply to be hooked up to a water line (any water I really do use when I'm there is additional - after some built-in minimum is consumed).  Granted the product received here in no way compares NOB.  Up there I automatically get pressurized clean drinkable water (no need for primary backwashable filter at the street inlet, no need to have a sump pump in the aljibe, no need for a pressure tank, no need for an aljibe, no need for a tinaco for emergencies, no need for carbon/paper/UV light filters AND ...... all the additional costs attributable to them eg. puchase price, installation, maintenance, replacement and CFE expense)  Also, NOB, if they decide on some kind of newfangled smart-type meter - I am not charged for it.

Now the only question is:  how much will they charge here per cu ft/mt2/gal?  And, if after metering everyone, it turns out to produce less income (whomever THEM is), since it has always simply been a guess on their part as to who is REALLY using up the water -- what will THEY do then?  Up the price across the board; identify those that appear they can afford to pay more (#banos, property size; yada-yada) or actually limit usage?  Who knows?  

I reviewed my old water bills and found my largest percentage jumps to be in 2011 and 2012.  Anyway MC, I think you've had it pretty good and don't really understand your anger on this subject, I don't think you could live anywhere else and pay as little as you do for the amenities you enjoy.  (However, I do understand the shock of a large % increase.  That kind of thing can really throw you off your budget), whether it is overdue or not.
Has anyone been able to get onto the site I mentioned earlier to obtain the proposed charges for ltr/gal usage levels?

What makes you think I'm angry?  I'm annoyed that these very poor government services are being ratcheted up in cost far faster than inflation.  Project that out a few years and you'll grasp the problem.  Not to mention that this thread and the one on TOB demonstrate just how arbitrary and capricious the billing for water is. Are you clueless about this going on or did you just arrive here?

Since we've moved here our property taxes and water bills have doubled.  At least the water service has improved, it is off a lot less though we still get periodic slugs of grunge down the line.  Chapala services have gone to hell, quite frankly.  I can count 20 potholes in the few streets around me alone and it is like that all over town.  And if you think I am down on Chapala, you should hear what our Mexican friends all have to say about them.  "Thieves" is the nicest thing they've called them.

And keep your personal comments to yourself.  I only mention what we have on our property in the context of water and taxation.
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Post by solajijic on Wed Jan 21, 2015 8:12 pm

Brigitte, one of the years I went was because your property water bill was significantly so much less than ours. With comparable houses, amenities and lots you'd think they would be somewhere in the same 1000 pesos range.

The jefe at Simapa (I think this was in 2008) did tell me that somewhere way in the past your property was assessed for a specific amount and ours was assessed and without major building changes those initial amounts would remain the same and increases would be based on that and he wasn't interested in lower the bill.

Such is.

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Post by brigitte on Wed Jan 21, 2015 8:37 pm

The house you lived in was there way before ours. Then our house was built on 700m so maybe it is when it was assessed...then someone bought the empty lot next door but did not build on it so that may explain why it was not reassessed or it was assessed differently since there was not house on it..who knows.. The interesting part is that they know what the size of the lot is as they came to measure it several times.

I guess a meter woulld be the way to go on that property because the grass area is pretty small.

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Post by hank chance on Wed Jan 21, 2015 9:34 pm

MC, I won't be rude if you won't be stupid. Have we got a deal?


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Post by Vandre on Wed Jan 21, 2015 10:00 pm

Thanks Hank. Your response to MC was much more succinct than mine would have been ... MC=angry/annoyed man and obviously not interested in problem understanding/solving ........

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Post by Mainecoons on Thu Jan 22, 2015 6:29 am

Nice to see you two have adopted the personal unpleasantness so typical of this board.

I have a deal for you, Hank. Let's get together and you can call me stupid to my face and we'll go from there. Or you can just lurk behind your keyboard like a big brave guy.

You both fit right in here.  Congratulations.  

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Post by CanuckBob on Thu Jan 22, 2015 6:45 am

Maines it is getting a little tiring to keep hearing you say "typical of this board" when you are one of the problems here. Your unwarranted attacks on every one of Pedro's posts the past couple of days are proof of that and you have started or been involved in spats on just about every other thread. Stop being a hypocrite.
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Post by Mainecoons on Thu Jan 22, 2015 7:08 am

Uh Bob, go back and look at Pedro's posts and see if you can figure out who started it. Let me know if you need help with that.



Thanks.

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Post by CanuckBob on Thu Jan 22, 2015 7:13 am

You are up to your ears in it Maines.......I can understand that TOB gets a little boring and you like to come over here and have some fun but the endless digs against us after you find yourself in the middle of the crap is confusing to say the least.
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Post by Mainecoons on Thu Jan 22, 2015 7:17 am

I didn't start it, Bob.  Read your own threads.  I didn't call Hank stupid and I didn't attempt to psycho analyze Vance.  I also didn't post on this board that Pedro rides in back because he can't keep up and quits early on rides.

You've allowed this board to get a poor reputation because those kinds of personal sniping are endemic here.  And then you compound the problem by ignoring the instigators and jumping on the targets.

It's your board and you can let it be this way but if you are going to do so, you should expect that someone who is attacked repeatedly will respond.  I don't start it but I will finish it.  If that isn't acceptable, ban me.

I'll be happy to stay on topic and not personalities. How about the rest of you?

Thanks.
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Post by Zedinmexico on Thu Jan 22, 2015 7:44 am

Everybody forget about it OK? Not worth the time. Folks read and see what they see.

Z

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Post by CanuckBob on Thu Jan 22, 2015 8:26 am

Mainecoons wrote:I didn't start it, Bob.  Read your own threads.  I didn't call Hank stupid and I didn't attempt to psycho analyze Vance.  I also didn't post on this board that Pedro rides in back because he can't keep up and quits early on rides.

You've allowed this board to get a poor reputation because those kinds of personal sniping are endemic here.  And then you compound the problem by ignoring the instigators and jumping on the targets.

It's your board and you can let it be this way but if you are going to do so, you should expect that someone who is attacked repeatedly will respond.  I don't start it but I will finish it.  If that isn't acceptable, ban me.

I'll be happy to stay on topic and not personalities.  How about the rest of you?

Thanks.

How about you simply ban youself and just stay away then.

I don't have a problem with what you are posting. I have a problem with the constant snivelling about the board.
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Post by viajero on Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:13 am

Mainecoons wrote:
I have a deal for you, Hank.  Let's get together and you can call me stupid to my face and we'll go from there.
That sounds like something a third grader would say.Rolling Eyes
Back on topic,we have two baths,there are three us and our water bill averages 50 pesos a month.


Last edited by viajero on Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:18 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Mainecoons on Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:14 am

Yeah, almost as bad as hiding behind one's keyboard and calling people names.

I suspect Hank and I can handle this without your help. I'm simply inviting him to man up and say to my face what he feels free to post on this board. That goes for the rest of you as well.

Better yet, why don't we all stick to topics and stop the gratuitous comments about people we don't even know?

Thanks.
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Post by Vandre on Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:23 am

Shall I assume this thread is no longer focused on ferreting out  and sharing any verified information on this topic "Water Bill"?  Input Anyone?

Thanks Viajero, you were posting as I was composing. Are you currently annual or on meter? How many hours a week is water being sent to the garden?


Last edited by Vandre on Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:31 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : crossed posts)

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Post by Lady Otter Latté on Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:31 am

Mainecoons, over on TOB you gave some excellent advice:
"And the fact of the matter is that you can simply ignore them and their threads or posts and skip the very worn out put down of "if you don't like it here, leave.""

I now offer you your own advice. You can simply ignore certain posters and posts here and skip the very worn out put down "typical of this board."

Now, back to the water bills.
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