Two More Texas Missionaries Killed in Northern Mexico

Gee, you got all that from the news story? Didn't realize you were an eye witness.

susan quote - "(those same missionaries ring my bell here to solicit, they can ring all day w/out a response. they are UN invited)"

Totally doubt that. No missionaries ringing bells in Ajijic or where do you live?

Not correct John. I had missionaries (or JW's) ringing the buzzer at my rental place in east Ajijic last April. I didn't take the time to read the brochure they left me so not sure what faith they were selling........

Solovino wrote:

Mainecoons wrote:

CheenaGringo wrote:MC:

Apparently history is not your forte! Here is a simple question for you: how many people have lost their lives in the name of religion (dictated by some church) and/or politics (dictated by some government)? Pretty darned naive to think that Church or State are not interchangeable in your following statement: "Government forces its attentions on people and other nations.."

And apparently reading is not yours. I didn't make a general statement about religion, I made a specific statement about these folks and a general statement about government. Which you tried to turn into a general statement about religion. Hint: "folks like these" means just what it says and no more.

Did you and Solo have the same reading comprehension teacher?

I scored in the top 1% in English comprehension nationally when tested in my youth. There is nothing you write I don't understand. In fact my very high comprehension level allow me to see through bullshit like yours with little to no effort.

Now I’ve stayed out of this entire BS for some time but when one starts believing in his own “greatness” it just too much. Solovino and a few others, if you were all that smart you would realize that kindness and humility out trumps IQ any day.

Apparently, John now has a new feature to add to his description of his home. What could be better than not having the missionaries ringing your doorbell?

Parker wrote:


Now I’ve stayed out of this entire BS for some time but when one starts believing in his own “greatness” it just too much. Solovino and a few others, if you were all that smart you would realize that kindness and humility out trumps IQ any day.

You're right you should have stayed out of it. And if you would bother to read all of the posts you would probably learn something.

CheenaGringo wrote:As one who gets upset when the US Government or any other Government decides to police the world, I feel the same way when a Church chooses to perform similar actions where they don't belong. It isn't a matter of blaming the victim, be they soldiers or God's warriors, but rather the the primary source of these deaths!

Well said, Neil:

Protestant missionaries in Chiapas have wreaked havoc among traditional indigenous communities which have adopted the Catholic faith with certain ancient pagan rituals attached to the liturgy and ceremonial festivities. Whether that is a good or bad development is according to one´s perspective. This introduction of foreign thought and religious principles has torn apart many indigenous communities in Chiapas but that is both a positive and negative development. After all, it was the European Christians who raped the indigenous and enslaved them and stole their land. Insurrection, whether based upon religious or secular motives can be considered either good or bad but one thing is certain in human affairs. Over time, as community leaders become entrenched and, thus vile and corrupted , revolution is an essential as a cleansing agent needed to rekindle the best of the human spirit which, sooner or later, will return to corruption. That´s why we all have to die before we become stratified in our own muck.

Dawg thinks it is time for revolution in the United States. Hang the undeserving among the rich from the nearest yardarm. The innovative and industrious are excused until they or their progeny relapse into corruption as is inevitable . The human condition.

IMO, believing that any church or religion is motivated by kindness and humility indicates drinking too much of the "kool-aid"! History has taught us that religions and their respective churches are [u]all about establishing a power base and then expanding that base through new converts[u]. While I certainly have no problem with people following a religion of their personal choice, I do object when they attempt to con or cajole myself or others into following the "right way". All too often the conning and cajoling doesn't work and then a war in the name of religion results. The same can be said for the antics of various governments throughout history. In both cases, deaths of the on the ground warriors for the cause are a cost of doing business.

hound dog wrote:

CheenaGringo wrote:As one who gets upset when the US Government or any other Government decides to police the world, I feel the same way when a Church chooses to perform similar actions where they don't belong. It isn't a matter of blaming the victim, be they soldiers or God's warriors, but rather the the primary source of these deaths!

Well said, Neil:

Protestant missionaries in Chiapas have wreaked havoc among traditional indigenous communities which have adopted the Catholic faith with certain ancient pagan rituals attached to the liturgy and ceremonial festivities. Whether that is a good or bad development is according to one´s perspective. This introduction of foreign thought and religious principles has torn apart many indigenous communities in Chiapas but that is both a positive and negative development. After all, it was the European Christians who raped the indigenous and enslaved them and stole their land. Insurrection, whether based upon religious or secular motives can be considered either good or bad but one thing is certain in human affairs. Over time, as community leaders become entrenched and, thus vile and corrupted , revolution is an essential as a cleansing agent needed to rekindle the best of the human spirit which, sooner or later, will return to corruption. That´s why we all have to die before we become stratified in our own muck.

Dawg thinks it is time for revolution in the United States. Hang the undeserving among the rich from the nearest yardarm. The innovative and industrious are excused until they or their progeny relapse into corruption as is inevitable . The human condition.

In Canada what was done to the indigenous was beyond inexcusable. Their kids were taken away and put in residential schools, some were molested sexually, and they were forbidden to speak their own languages or practice any of their traditional spiritual practices. As for their land, any land which had something of interest to the foreigners was expropriated. Most of this was done under the auspices of religion with the ardent help of the government.

CheenaGringo wrote:IMO, believing that any church or religion is motivated by kindness and humility indicates drinking too much of the "kool-aid"! History has taught us that religions and their respective churches are [u]all about establishing a power base and then expanding that base through new converts[u]. While I certainly have no problem with people following a religion of their personal choice, I do object when they attempt to con or cajole myself or others into following the "right way". All too often the conning and cajoling doesn't work and then a war in the name of religion results. The same can be said for the antics of various governments throughout history. In both cases, deaths of the on the ground warriors for the cause are a cost of doing business.

Neil,
I’m not sure if your reference was to me or not but since you repeated my words exactly “kindness and humility” let’s assume you are. First of all I mentioned nothing about religion because to me religion is almost the exact opposite. All they ever want is attention and true and sincere kindness is rarely found, IMHO. When someone needs everyone to see there “good deeds” I find it insincere. I still believe that kindness and humility are the secret to a good and successful life. Just being kind is O.K and humble keeps others from being jealous. No religion involved.

Parker:

It wasn't so much that I was referring to you but I thought the two words were so descriptive of the party line used by many religions and churches.

john almighty what gift do you have that the rest of us dont? lets see, 1) you know for sure the "people in ajijic" pay contractors less than you. did they give you statistics? or are you just being nasty? 2) how do you now for sure that CB & i never had missionaries ring the bell? how? are you just being ornery? these missionaries have been ringing for years. i even sat next to them on a plane trip to guad. 4) you posted your address on the net, you fool. i will tell them you need to "be saved". now your bell will be ringing.

What I can't figure out CG is why you hijacked your own thread about a couple who were murdered into a general rant about organized religion, a topic on which you and I largely agree.

None of you have a basis for concluding these poor folks weren't sincerely trying to help drug addicts. Faith based solutions for drug counseling have shown results, why is that so bad?

A lot of blame the victims here IMO.

the only people who can help addicts ate former addicts. read my other post. the helpers should be in the same age group & also should come from the same culture or backround. it is dangerous as well to meddle.

Thank you for your pontifications. Of course, they're bull shit, but thank you anyway.

the road to hell is paved w/good intentions. when its not the proper road, it back fires. thats the law of the universe. sincere people? no! foolish patronizing people.